Merged: Kings interested in Dennis Schröder? (Putting #8 pick on trading block)

[NBASupes]

1) If we send Teague to Sac, I expect #8 and McClemore at least.

2) Not big on Ennis at all personally. Still not big on MCW either honestly. Would rather keep Schröder than either (I know I'm in the minority there). I'm about 50/50 on judging these prospects though so take that for what it's worth.

3) Sac town wouldn't take Sap unless we took back someone like Landry or Thompson, we're not doing that UNLESS it leads to Love.

4) The main reason to trade for the #8 pick is to collect assets for Love. Trading Teague for #8/McClemore and then flipping them to Minnesota along with Sap and some sweeteners for Love is not out of the realm of possibility. LAL would also entertain Teague for Nash/#7 as well I think if Minnesota likes the sound of that better.

I think we could potentially deal Teague and Millsap to land both the #7 and #8. That's a solid haul for Love.

Edit: The issue then is finding a starting PG. We'd have to pursue Lowry pretty hard.

Edit 2: Or Lin, perhaps.

Their not trading us their top 10 pick who flashes potential and their #8. Not happening.

[Guest]

I would only do #8 for Schröder if Vonleh or Smart are available. If they are than you gotta pull the trigger asap. Schröder and #15 for #8 i'm not really feeling tbh

So ur the one reading my posts!!!

[Diesel]

I dunno why this is all the sudden so complicated. I think Teague and Mack showed that they could be our PG set for the next 4 yrs at least. Dennis is the backup. IF SacTown wants Dennis/#15... for #8... then we pony up. IF they will take Dennis for #8, we send him happily. This is not that complicated. Dennis will not become the man on our team, but we can improve our draft possibility by moving up. It's a win for us. Period. There's no need in talking about Teague or Millsap instead, let's not change what is working.

[Diesel]

I was just thinking about the possibility. If We get #8 for Dennis/#15... and Randle or Vunleh falls to us, in terms of development, what do we do with either of these guys.

BTW. The best possible backcourt is Teague/Exum. We should call the Magic and see what they want.

[Buzzard]

Dennis is likely to follow in the footsteps of the recent foreign players never living up to hype or being flat out bust.

Dennis is the clear one to trade. Good riddance if they will give 8 for the guy. Foreigners have shown over time that they are overhyped even more so than Americans in these drafts.

I agree with this. Dennis for 8 is a big time upgrade on picks when you consider this deep draft. But I would hope for not having to ship 15. Dennis reminds me more of a lesser Rubio than anything remotely close to Rondo.

Edited May 23, 2014 by Buzzard

[Admin]

Always count on @Diesel willing to give as much as possible to the other team. I'm confident you're in the overwhelming minority that would give up Schröder AND the 15th to get the 8th pick. A top 5 pick I would be game but at 8 the likelihood of getting a guy at a position of need is very small and we could stay at 15 and get someone who fits our needs. Save Schröder for a trade for a vet.

[red2play]

no way you trade what looks to be an eventual starting PG for the 8th pick in a lousy draft. No way.

[Diesel]

Always count on @Diesel willing to give as much as possible to the other team. I'm confident you're in the overwhelming minority that would give up Schröder AND the 15th to get the 8th pick. A top 5 pick I would be game but at 8 the likelihood of getting a guy at a position of need is very small and we could stay at 15 and get someone who fits our needs. Save Schröder for a trade for a vet.

All I'm saying is getting #8 for Dennis is you can, but if they push for #15... why not. Neither Dennis or #15 will have the value that #8 is going to have. How many more John Jenkins do you want. At 8, we have the opportunity to get a nice player, especially if one falls to us. I have a feeling that in this market, good players will fall. The problem is that there is so much parity in the top of this draft. Wiggins is not better than guys behind him. to about 10. At 15, we're hoping for either Hood or Saric to fall. That's a big hope. If the same deal excited Orlando, I would do that one and get Exum without blinking.

[Admin]

no way you trade what looks to be an eventual starting PG for the 8th pick in a lousy draft. No way.

Lousy draft? He was the 17th pick in an actually lousy draft and if we can get the 8th pick in a much better draft we have to consider it.

[Diesel]

no way you trade what looks to be an eventual starting PG for the 8th pick in a lousy draft. No way.

First off... Eventual Starter where? Teague is better, Mack is better and both are more suited for this offense than Dennis. Second... Lousy Draft... You have discounted your opinion right there. This is the best draft since prolly 2005.

[Admin]

All I'm saying is getting #8 for Dennis is you can, but if they push for #15... why not. Neither Dennis or #15 will have the value that #8 is going to have. How many more John Jenkins do you want. At 8, we have the opportunity to get a nice player, especially if one falls to us. I have a feeling that in this market, good players will fall. The problem is that there is so much parity in the top of this draft. Wiggins is not better than guys behind him. to about 10. At 15, we're hoping for either Hood or Saric to fall. That's a big hope. If the same deal excited Orlando, I would do that one and get Exum without blinking.

Because the #8 this year isn't worth two 1st round picks that's why. If they push for it then we say good luck to ya because it's well known the Kings don't want to add another rookie to the team.

You guys keep doubting Schröder and Jenkins and even Bebe but they're going to show you that they are quality players who will contribute to our team if we keep them.

[MaceCase]

This is not a very good draft. It was overly hyped beforehand but as the season went on GMs and scouts began to realize that it's not as strong as once believed. If this draft was 2006 level no one would be contemplating giving away their pick in the first place. It's top heavy and even the top prospects have a whole slew of questions around them. Wiggins has the heart of Marvin, Embiid has his back issue drawing comparisons to Oden, Parker looks like Beasley without the crazy and Randle is Boozer. Everyone after that is a tier below with major questions over their size, position, experience and skill. Starters and rotation players sure but this draft will be lacking in all the future HOFers that some fans and pundits were screaming about for yeas before.

[AHF]

I would only do #8 for Schröder if Vonleh or Smart are available. If they are than you gotta pull the trigger asap. Schröder and #15 for #8 i'm not really feeling tbh

If you wait until the 7th or 8th pick is actually on the clock, your odds of getting the trade done drop significantly. You have absolutely no chance at getting a big steal if the next Paul Pierce situation plays out (he was predicted to go #3 and then fell to #10) because Sacto will simply take the guy who fell. Other teams will also be in competition and waiting until the last minute means Sacto is more likely to feel invested in getting the pick after they have done all their due diligence, etc. It isn't impossible but the uncertainty now increases the chance for a trade. Once you ensure that Smart drops to #8, for example, the odds of Sacramento still pulling the trigger aren't very good.

Like others, I would want something else in the mix for the Hawks if the Kings want Schröder and our #15.

[ag82]

Here's a great article from grantland today on the draft and opinions are definitely different than they were a few months ago. I mentioned a few months ago that scouts were cooling on this draft class and I caught some crap for it.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ryen-russillos-nba-draft-confidential-real-scouts-on-wiggins-randle-embiid-and-parker/

A couple of quotes and remember that these are coming from 3 different scouts with differing opinions as well as Ryen Russillo.

I just included a couple quotes on Wiggins since his stock has probably dropped the most. Everyone seems high on Embiid if he is healthy, but that is a big IF. Even Parker and Randle have a lot more holes in their game than most people thought. Anyways, interesting read.

The 2014 draft was supposed to have three or four franchise-changing players. That idea is actually pretty ridiculous when you think about it. There aren’t even 10 current players capable of turning a team into an immediate contender.

On Wiggins:

Don’t trust his shot or his ball skills. Can’t go left. There is no “f*** you” to him. Kobe’s like, “f*** you, I’m better than you.” Where was that? I think he is a content player... He can be your third-best player, but not your best. Say he goes to Orlando. What’s he going to do as an offensive player? Shoot them to more wins?..He can be an elite defender. He can guard 1-3s.. Wiggins has offensive holes in his game — no dribble, no pass, streaky shooter. His sex appeal is only his athleticism..

He will be lost in an NBA half-court offense. He is great in transition, but he has no ball skills. All right hand, no idea what to do without the ball. He struggles with confidence. He actually reminds me more of Gerald Green than any of these studs he’s compared to.. He needs to add a whole bunch of other stuff to be the scorer people think he can be. He needs to forget shooting 3s

Athletically, he is off the charts, but it doesn’t do much for you if you can’t dribble. Right now, he can’t. The times he does get free on a drive, he doesn’t finish nearly as much as he should. It’s baffling; he gets by his man, beats the help, and then screws up the layup.

[sturt]

My perception of Bud and Ferry both are that they are more than merely guys who acquire talent, but rather are capable of developing talent. Now, admittedly, maybe that's just my optimistic nature, but it's not without some substance given the system that both were steeped in prior to their ATL arrivals. And, moreover, I believe I saw a shrug-of-the-shoulders 2nd rounder from the 2012 draft significantly advance his game significantly in his second year such that he arguably won a playoff game for us.

That's why I don't even blink at the idea that Schröder, Bebe and even Muscala will pay some dividends later that cannot be assessed very well after one year. (Jenkins? I'm less bullish due to the nature of his injury... back problems are so often so difficult to overcome.) If we were to part with Schröder, I feel like we could be guilty of having bought Apple stock during the height of early MAC celebrity, and selling at pre-IPad prices. I believe being able to settle in and not be considered a fast-track heir to the PG throne, and too, naturally growing more accustomed to his relatively new U.S. environment, will allow him to achieve the comfort level

necessary to get back to shooting the ball as he did prior to being drafted.

[AHF]

My perception of Bud and Ferry both are that they are more than merely guys who acquire talent, but rather are capable of developing talent. Now, admittedly, maybe that's just my optimistic nature, but it's not without some substance given the system that both were steeped in prior to their ATL arrivals. And, moreover, I believe I saw a shrug-of-the-shoulders 2nd rounder from the 2012 draft significantly advance his game significantly in his second year such that he arguably won a playoff game for us.

If we were to part with Schröder, I feel like we could be guilty of having bought Apple stock during the height of early MAC celebrity, and selling at pre-IPad prices.

I agree that Bebe and Schröder are both guys who we can't assess after one year. However, the idea that we flip the #15 pick in 2013 for the #8 pick in 2014 and that constitutes selling at "pre-iPad prices" doesn't make sense to me. I would get that argument if you were talking about trading him for the 22nd pick or something but moving to the middle of the lottery doesn't fit with your analogy.

[Guest]

If you wait until the 7th or 8th pick is actually on the clock, your odds of getting the trade done drop significantly. You have absolutely no chance at getting a big steal if the next Paul Pierce situation plays out (he was predicted to go #3 and then fell to #10) because Sacto will simply take the guy who fell. Other teams will also be in competition and waiting until the last minute means Sacto is more likely to feel invested in getting the pick after they have done all their due diligence, etc. It isn't impossible but the uncertainty now increases the chance for a trade. Once you ensure that Smart drops to #8, for example, the odds of Sacramento still pulling the trigger aren't very good.

Like others, I would want something else in the mix for the Hawks if the Kings want Schröder and our #15.

No - unless the guy you absolutely WANT is there at the pick you are trading up to get you do not do the deal (see the George Hill/Kawhi Leonard deal). If Leonard was not available SAS would not have done the deal.

[bird_dirt]

"There is no *beep* you to him. Kobes like, *beep* you, Im better than you. Where was that? I think he is a content player... "

HELLO?! He's Canadian! Even if he has some *beep* you to him in Canada, he'd actually use *beep* instead of the f-bomb.

[AHF]

No - unless the guy you absolutely WANT is there at the pick you are trading up to get you do not do the deal (see the George Hill/Kawhi Leonard deal). If Leonard was not available SAS would not have done the deal.

I agree with that but I see the list of the top 8 and I want all 8 of those players over Schröder as of today. Further, I think we won't get the deal done and we wait because the pick will no longer be available or we will be outbid. Just as we would want to wait and pounce, other teams will do the same.

At 15 (where Leonard was drafted), there are more moving parts and it is harder to predict and the picks don't have the same perceived value.

To each their own - and I have been plenty wrong on the draft before - but I liked the Schröder pick last year and would pull the trigger on this today.

[Jody23]

I'm all for making a trade IF you can get a guy who's going to be really good, but not just because it's "the eighth pick".

While there's no guarantee he'll put it all together, Dennis has ability. And he's only 20.

Dennis Schröder Hawks 2014 Season Highlights: http://youtu.be/zpw2MH4U1_Y