Would Cavs want Horford or more?

[HawkItus]

Where'd you find that? I already posted what NBADraft.net listed as his weaknesses. (I refuse to browse a prospect page on Dx anymore as they have a bunch of videos that auto-play and the page takes forever to load or crashes).

Scout.com

Just found this on ESPN:

Draft Analysis

Davis has the chance to be a superstar. He has the potential to be a Tim Duncan/Kevin Garnett hybrid and win multiple Defensive Player of the Year awards. He also will be better offensively than people think. Davis is the perfect piece to build around for the Hornets. -- Chad Ford

Draft Results

Player Evaluations By Chad Ford

Overall Rank 1 Position Rank 1 Hollinger PER 35.71 Projection No. 1 Pick

New Orleans Hornets Positives

• Long, athletic wing
• Excellent rebounder and shot blocker
• Good ball handler for his size
• Excels at taking people off the dribble
• Can defend multiple positions
• Tough
• Terrific motor

Negatives

• Needs to add strength/muscle
• Still figuring out how to play in the post

[Admin]

Scout.com

Just found this on ESPN:

Draft Analysis

Davis has the chance to be a superstar. He has the potential to be a Tim Duncan/Kevin Garnett hybrid and win multiple Defensive Player of the Year awards. He also will be better offensively than people think. Davis is the perfect piece to build around for the Hornets. -- Chad Ford

Draft Results

Player Evaluations By Chad Ford

Overall Rank 1 Position Rank 1 Hollinger PER 35.71 Projection No. 1 Pick

New Orleans Hornets Positives

• Long, athletic wing
• Excellent rebounder and shot blocker
• Good ball handler for his size
• Excels at taking people off the dribble
• Can defend multiple positions
• Tough
• Terrific motor

Negatives

• Needs to add strength/muscle
• Still figuring out how to play in the post

That's fine and it actually highlights 2 of the areas I'm referring to so let's not pretend like there weren't questions about his size and durability and his offensive game as he still has question marks surrounding the first 2 of those.

Speaking of ESPN / Chad Ford scouting reports, guess who they're talking about here?

Said to be a shot-blocking, ambidextrous post scorer who could shoot from both mid-range and behind the arc with incredibly accuracy. He was a physical seven-footer and played with an incredible motor.

Money Quote: "He's the real deal. He's really one of a kind. He runs the floor, handles the ball, shoots the NBA 3-pointer, plays with his back to the basket, so you can slot him in at the 3, 4 or 5." - Chad Ford, ESPN.com

[cam1218]

I'm one of the biggest Horford fans on this site. That said, I'd trade him for the #1 pick without hesitation. I wouldn't give up anything else unless it was to benefit us salary wise or talent wise.

Horford is a legitimate all star but he also has his injury concerns. I'm not sure if I would take Embiid because of his injury concerns, but I'd understand it if we did. Obviously our guys have advanced scouting reports on the big three so I trust their judgment.

[cam1218]

No he wasn't. There were major questions about his ability to score and his ability to withstand the pounding he has to take at his generously listed 220 lbs. So far in 2 seasons he's played 60 and 66 games.

Now, he's a far superior offensive player than many expected but he wasn't a can't miss prospect.

Dolf is right in this argument. Davis has wound up being much much better than many of us expected. He wasn't a can't miss #1 guy when he came out of college.

[HawkItus]

That's fine but don't pretend like there weren't questions about his size and durability and his offensive game as he still has question marks surrounding the first 2 of those.

Speaking of ESPN / Chad Ford scouting reports, guess who they're talking about here?

He also said this:

Chad Ford, ESPN Insider: I can't agree with you Jon. LeBron is much more versatile than Carmelo. He's a better handler, passer, rebounder and athlete. Neither of them are great perimeter shooters, but they aren't bad either. LeBron's more athletic and should be able to play three to four positions in the pros. Carmelo will be a small forward and nothing else. While I agree that Carmelo's proven more on a bigger stage, all the evidence suggests that LeBron is the better player. I think Carmelo is a distant third to LeBron and Darko.

You hit and you miss. I never saw Davis mentioned as anything, but the guy to take and the Pelicans were never discussing not taking him. Same with Griffin etc. These guys dominated in college. I don't see than in any of these guys.

[HawkItus]

Dolf is right in this argument. Davis has wound up being much much better than many of us expected. He wasn't a can't miss #1 guy when he came out of college.

I'm not talking about this board lol. I rarely agree with this board. I'm talking scouts. The scouts were sold on Davis.

http://www.mynbadraft.com/NBA-Draft-Profiles-2012/Anthony-Davis

[Admin]

He also said this:

You hit and you miss. I never saw Davis mentioned as anything, but the guy to take and the Pelicans were never discussing not taking him. Same with Griffin etc. These guys dominated in college. I don't see than in any of these guys.

Because there weren't other better options. I'm not saying that Davis wasn't the consensus #1 pick. What I'm saying and I'm having a hard time seeing how you can deny this, is that there were questions about him.

[Admin]

I'm not talking about this board lol. I rarely agree with this board. I'm talking scouts. The scouts were sold on Davis.

http://www.mynbadraft.com/NBA-Draft-Profiles-2012/Anthony-Davis

From your link. AGAIN highlighting ALL 3 things I heard most as negatives about Anthony Davis.

The negatives for Anthony will start with size and strength. Even though his length and athleticism is ideal he is too light for an NBA big at around 225lbs. Anthony will probably never be a player who uses a lot of muscle or looked at as an explosive player but it is his wiry strength and agility that wins down low. Anthony doesn’t have many go to moves in the post, and has not showed a lot of go to scoring ability. His size will bring durability concerns.

[cam1218]

I'm not talking about this board lol. I rarely agree with this board. I'm talking scouts. The scouts were sold on Davis.

http://www.mynbadraft.com/NBA-Draft-Profiles-2012/Anthony-Davis

I'm not going with the boards opinion, just what I remember hearing and seeing. He was an obvious first pick but his draft class wasn't considered that great to begin with.

[HawkItus]

Because there weren't other better options. I'm not saying that Davis wasn't the consensus #1 pick. What I'm saying and I'm having a hard time seeing how you can deny this, is that there were questions about him.

Every player has weaknesses. The stuff I've posted say this. But, nobody was saying the Pelicans would trade the pick for anybody. It was a non-starter they wanted him and only Lebron or Durant would have gotten them to trade. The questions were more about fit than they were about his ability.

http://www.nba.com/draft/2012/prospects/anthony-davis/

Edited May 29, 2014 by sultanofatl

[Admin]

Every player has weaknesses. The stuff I've posted say this. But, nobody was saying the Pelicans would trade the pick for anybody. It was a non-starter they wanted him and only Lebron or Durant would have gotten them to trade. The questions were more about fit than they were about his ability.

http://www.nba.com/draft/2012/prospects/anthony-davis/

Who ever said that? I never said that once.

And yes there were questions about him, which I'm not going to bother to post AGAIN.

[HawkItus]

From your link. AGAIN highlighting ALL 3 things I heard most as negatives about Anthony Davis.

Again that never said he was questionable talent lol. They are pointing out the weaknesses. But, the final verdict is he is a good safe pick at #1 that could be a superstar and he has the NCAA chops to back it up. Kareem was the only player who had succeeded as much as Davis had before the draft.

[Admin]

Again that never said he was questionable talent lol. They are pointing out the weaknesses. But, the final verdict is he is a good safe pick at #1 that could be a superstar and he has the NCAA chops to back it up. Kareem was the only player who had succeeded as much as Davis had before the draft.

And AGAIN I never said he was a questionable talent. You're just arguing to argue here.

[HawkItus]

And AGAIN I never said he was a questionable talent. You're just arguing to argue here.

Dude this was your response to me.......

sultanofatl, on 29 May 2014 - 1:17 PM, said:

No he wasn't. There were major questions about his ability to score and his ability to withstand the pounding he has to take at his generously listed 220 lbs. So far in 2 seasons he's played 60 and 66 games.

Now, he's a far superior offensive player than many expected but he wasn't a can't miss prospect.

I think the pre-draft stuff I posted showed he was a can't miss guy......

[Admin]

Dude this was your response to me.......

I think the pre-draft stuff I posted showed he was a can't miss guy......

I know what I said. He wasn't a can't miss prospect. Where did I say he's a questionable talent? How about you answer my 3 points of contention throughout this thread so that we can put this to bed.

Did he have questions about his size?

Did he have questions about his durability?

Did he have questions about his ability to score in the post?

And sorry but there's been TWO can't miss prospects in the past decade and that's Lebron and Durant.

[HawkItus]

I know what I said. He wasn't a can't miss prospect. Where did I say he's a questionable talent? How about you answer my 3 points of contention throughout this thread so that we can put this to bed.

Did he have questions about his size?

Did he have questions about his durability?

Did he have questions about his ability to score in the post?

And sorry but there's been TWO can't miss prospects in the past decade and that's Lebron and Durant.

Durant:

Liabilities

Double teams have proven to trouble him as he doesn’t always read them quick enough … While he is unselfish, he lacks the passing ability to create for his teammates … To his credit he isn’t a terribly poor passer but certainly doesn’t stand out at this point in his career … Defensively he is improving and showing a willingness to improve, but still needs to work on his perimeter defense in terms of his anticipation skills and footwork … Has a tendency to bite on fakes when going for the block, so improvement on his timing and patience will eliminate this … Like most freshmen in college Durant will need to add more weight and body strength. He probably will always be on the slim side due to his narrow chest, but it shouldn't hinder him much except finishing inside … Doesn’t always take full advantage of mismatches, often Durant will settle for the outside jumper, granted it's not a horrible alternative … Body strength doesn’t allow him to finish after contact … Despite being such a dominate offensive force, Durant can go through stretches of games where he appears fatigued and won’t demand the ball … Gets pushed out rather easily on rebounds due to his body strength … Although not a major flaw, it should be noted that Durant operates primarily on the right side of the floor … Ball protection will need to be worked on as he can get careless with the ball

Strengths

• 3-Point Range
• Big-Time Scorer
• Upside/Potential

To Improve

• Low Block Scorer
• Mid-Range Game
• Strength

Negatives

• Strength. Durant's body keeps him from being one of the most complete forwards in the game. He needs to add 15 to 20 pounds of muscle. Given his slight frame, that could be an issue. Doesn't play defense with any intensity.

You know what Dolf, we agree to disagree, because you won't concede and I'm right!

Edited May 29, 2014 by sultanofatl

[Admin]

Durant:

You know what Dolf, we agree to disagree, because you won't concede and I'm right!

Fair enough, I'll concede Durant then, which really says a lot about how much of a CAN miss prospect that Davis would be in comparison to KD. All your point here makes is that there aren't can't miss prospects if the 2nd best player in the league wasn't a can't miss prospect.

And you still didn't answer my questions.

Did he have questions about his size?

Did he have questions about his durability?

Did he have questions about his ability to score in the post?

[Guest]

I remember getting blasted by some people on here when I said I would move Horford for Anthony Davis when he was in the draft. You don't get those guys for someone like Horford (fringe All-Star with recent injury problems) once they have blossomed fully.

I know I didn't blast you AHF. I thought Davis was like a Tim Duncan type. Plus, I know your a Kentucky fan and prolly saw more of him that most people on here. Like with Dolf and Syracuse.

On a sidenote, I feel like I'm somewhat good at guessing and predicting the success of a player. But twice I was dead wrong. I thought Marvin Williams would be the next James Worthy and like him over Deron Williams but not over CP3. I thought cp3 was a lot like Zeke Thomas. Zeke>big game James. Also I thought Blake Griffin would be a huuuuuge bust. Screwed up on that as well. Griffin has turned out to be pretty good. Still a lot of holes in his game but I seriously thought he'd turn out like Marvin, huge bust.

[cam1218]

I know what I said. He wasn't a can't miss prospect. Where did I say he's a questionable talent? How about you answer my 3 points of contention throughout this thread so that we can put this to bed.

Did he have questions about his size?

Did he have questions about his durability?

Did he have questions about his ability to score in the post?

And sorry but there's been TWO can't miss prospects in the past decade and that's Lebron and Durant.

I'd probably say LeBron and Dwight? KD was picked after Oden who might have also been a can't miss guy because of his size (and maybe being 38 playing college ball).

[NJHAWK]

If I could be assured Horfords healthy I wouldnt touch this trade. We wouldnt be getting anything close to what Horford gives us back. Embied scares the crap out of me as a bust. Wiggings and Parker may at best a few years from now be borderline all stars. Im not giving up a guy whose close to 20/10 for any of those 3, not the way Buds offense was working and they way we played while Al was healthy.

Edited May 29, 2014 by NJHAWK