This is what they think?

[ag82]

Losing josh was addition by subtraction. That guy is a cancer to the game of basketball.

Cap space/roster space got us Millsap, a much much better player.

You use the word "maybe" so many times. Maybe you don't know every phone call ferry had made and maybe you know less than you think about a guy who is notorious for keeping quiet about his moves.

It almost feels like you are most upset about the way in which ferry conducts deals, rather than the outcome. We got rid of several contracts that were considered untradeable, and picked up good players on good deals.

I get that you are upset with the lack of a big name splash, but why not let the season play out a bit with our great new coach, 2 all stars in the front court, growing explosive pg who has proved himself in the playoffs, best shooter in the league, and now tons of depth off the bench.

This rush to declare everything a miserable failure before anything had started is so bizarre.

[Diesel]

Losing josh was addition by subtraction. That guy is a cancer to the game of basketball.

Cap space/roster space got us Millsap, a much much better player.

You use the word "maybe" so many times. Maybe you don't know every phone call ferry had made and maybe you know less than you think about a guy who is notorious for keeping quiet about his moves.

It almost feels like you are most upset about the way in which ferry conducts deals, rather than the outcome. We got rid of several contracts that were considered untradeable, and picked up good players on good deals.

I get that you are upset with the lack of a big name splash, but why not let the season play out a bit with our great new coach, 2 all stars in the front court, growing explosive pg who has proved himself in the playoffs, best shooter in the league, and now tons of depth off the bench.

This rush to declare everything a miserable failure before anything had started is so bizarre.

 

Well, what are these successful outcomes?

 

Addition by subtraction is an excuse that is made up when somebody gets nothing for something.  Had we gotten even 2 second round picks for Josh Smith, wouldn't it have been better than getting nothing?  How about a future first and a non-guaranteed contract?  What about an exchange of 1st round picks?  Aren't those things better than losing one of our top guys and getting nothing back for him?

We have to stop lying to ourselves.   Sure, we're glad that he is gone, but he had value and we didn't capitalize off of his value.  Nor did Ferry interact with Josh during that time.  It shows a degree of unpreparedness by our gm.  Even BK got a pick for Harrington.

So for a guy like Josh who broke just about every historical record we have, we got Nothing... and he is in his prime?  And you want to celebrate us getting nothing??  Sorry my friend.  This is not an albatrose contract going out the door.  This was a free agent whom we could have used in a deal.

[kerrypack]

we had sheed for a cup o coffee in 01 or 02? he won in 04 w detroit.

[MaceCase]

Diesel, just a week ago you realized that sign and trades are useless in this current CBA for a team already far enough under the cap to sign a player (the same was true with the last CBA but I digress) yet now you're babbling about not getting anything for Josh. The same Josh that teams offered nothing but turd sandwiches for in his last season as a Hawk. The same Josh that Detroit had to pull out of trade talks again because all teams are offering are turd sandwiches, they now will attempt to see if he actually gains any value.

Perhaps you'd get the hint that teams aren't willing to give up anything of worth for him. Dumars was rumored as coveting Josh for years yet even he had the sense to wait till he had cap space to go after him instead of offering up any assets. This isn't about a GM being unprepared, it's about a fan having trouble reconciling the truth with their own fantasies.

Josh will forever be more valuable to the Hawks than any other franchise in the league (barring those that already own Detroit's draft picks). He was like a family heirloom, priceless to you but a hunk of shit to everyone else.

[AHF]

We got Rasheed Wallace long after he won in Detroit.

There is some real revisionist history going up in this thread.

Diesel is 100% right about Wallace and Detroit. Wallace never played for Detroit before Atlanta dealt him there.

I still feel good about that one since we converted that to Josh Smith .

[Diesel]

Diesel, just a week ago you realized that sign and trades are useless in this current CBA for a team already far enough under the cap to sign a player (the same was true with the last CBA but I digress) yet now you're babbling about not getting anything for Josh. The same Josh that teams offered nothing but turd sandwiches for in his last season as a Hawk. The same Josh that Detroit had to pull out of trade talks again because all teams are offering are turd sandwiches, they now will attempt to see if he actually gains any value.

Perhaps you'd get the hint that teams aren't willing to give up anything of worth for him. Dumars was rumored as coveting Josh for years yet even he had the sense to wait till he had cap space to go after him instead of offering up any assets. This isn't about a GM being unprepared, it's about a fan having trouble reconciling the truth with their own fantasies.

Josh will forever be more valuable to the Hawks than any other franchise in the league (barring those that already own Detroit's draft picks). He was like a family heirloom, priceless to you but a hunk of shit to everyone else.

 

But what about the teams that were not far enough under the cap to secure him.  Mace, you have to understand you don't let value fly out the door and not try to get something for it.  Addition by subtraction is a myth.  Next, you will be trying to tell me how untradable Bebe was so we had to push him into a trade for cap flexibility.  

 

As far as Turd sandwhiches go, Monta Ellis would have looked good in a Hawks Jersey!  So would the first round pick that Milwaukee was offering. Jabari Parker anybody?

 

 

Open up your eyes.

 

We are still in the Firesale and most of yall think that DFerry is doing something.  He's doing just what the ASG wants him to do.  Keep the cost low and the team in the playoffs. 

[macdaddy]

This is pointless but if you think Josh is so valuable then why are the Pistons so desperate to get rid of this great player in his prime.  No one in the league wanted this headache.  No one was offering anything.  No one would send us anything in a sign and trade for a unrestricted free agent certainly not Monroe.  They aren't sending a great young PF, on a rookie contract, that they have complete control over out to the Hawks when they could just sign Josh out right without losing anything.   Want proof?  THAT'S WHAT THEY FRIGGIN DID.

 

It's one thing to disagree with the deals DF is doing but trying to make the case, from your la-z-boy, that he is so incompetent and stupid that he would just ignore all the glorious return he could have gotten for Josh is ridiculous

[Guest]

But what about the teams that were not far enough under the cap to secure him. Mace, you have to understand you don't let value fly out the door and not try to get something for it. Addition by subtraction is a myth. Next, you will be trying to tell me how untradable Bebe was so we had to push him into a trade for cap flexibility.

As far as Turd sandwhiches go, Monta Ellis would have looked good in a Hawks Jersey! So would the first round pick that Milwaukee was offering. Jabari Parker anybody?

Open up your eyes.

We are still in the Firesale and most of yall think that DFerry is doing something. He's doing just what the ASG wants him to do. Keep the cost low and the team in the playoffs.

1. The pick had a lottery protection on it so we wouldn't haven't gotten Parker.

2. Ellis was also a free agent so there is no telling if he would have resigned with the Hawks

2. Udoh, Udrih? Really - they would still be on our roster.

It's over - we got Milksap to replace Josh. Sometimes it's better to do no deal than a bad deal.

[MaceCase]

But what about the teams that were not far enough under the cap to secure him.  Mace, you have to understand you don't let value fly out the door and not try to get something for it.  Addition by subtraction is a myth.  Next, you will be trying to tell me how untradable Bebe was so we had to push him into a trade for cap flexibility.  

 

As far as Turd sandwhiches go, Monta Ellis would have looked good in a Hawks Jersey!  So would the first round pick that Milwaukee was offering. Jabari Parker anybody?

 

 

Open up your eyes.

 

We are still in the Firesale and most of yall think that DFerry is doing something.  He's doing just what the ASG wants him to do.  Keep the cost low and the team in the playoffs. 

Do you even read what you post?  Ellis was not part of the deal, what took them so long in the first place was that Ferry was fighting to get either Ellis or Ilyasova included and Milwaukee said no because Milwaukee was going for a playoff push and wanted contributors not to give up any.  The final deal on the table as reported by multiple sources was Mbah Moute, Udrih, Udoh and a protected 1st. That is the very definition of a turd sandwich.  Josh was so "valuable" that the Hawks had to take on an extra 13.5 million of dead salary just for the opportunity of a protected pick.  As an FYI, Sap, Demarre and Pero together cost the Hawks 13.3 million last season, that's your addition by subtraction right there.

Edited August 1, 2014 by MaceCase

[Diesel]

This is pointless but if you think Josh is so valuable then why are the Pistons so desperate to get rid of this great player in his prime.  No one in the league wanted this headache.  No one was offering anything.  No one would send us anything in a sign and trade for a unrestricted free agent certainly not Monroe.  They aren't sending a great young PF, on a rookie contract, that they have complete control over out to the Hawks when they could just sign Josh out right without losing anything.   Want proof?  THAT'S WHAT THEY FRIGGIN DID.

 

It's one thing to disagree with the deals DF is doing but trying to make the case, from your la-z-boy, that he is so incompetent and stupid that he would just ignore all the glorious return he could have gotten for Josh is ridiculous

 

So which do you believe and which do you not believe?  Mac, it seems like you are coming with a wavering mind.  Here you say nobody wanted Smith.  Next post you applaud Jay for pointing out so called flaws with all the possible trades of Smith.  So let's go with your second mind... the one where you agree with trades for Smith.  Makes it easier to rebutt both you and Jay.

 

SO here's the deal.

 

Ellis would have been a free agent too?  OK!

Lottery protected first from Milwaukee?  OK!!

Udoh, Udrih?  OK!

 

Point is that the Ellis and a protected first would have been much better than just losing Smith for nothing.

Secondly... we would have been able to get Millsap anyway.  Had you forgotten that we were trying to get D12 and CP3???  Maybe we couldn't have wasted money on Ayón and Brand.. but we would have still been able to get Sap and DMC.