Scott vs. Payne

[Diesel]

Truth is... is that I really didn't expect us to resign Scott after we signed Payne.  The reason why is because I felt that Scott is OK but not worth so much.

Now we have a battle of the yunguns.   Both are big.  Both have good touch from outside.  Both can play inside.

My question is... which one of these guys will get the nod?

 

If we were to put up a a depth chart of our guys, here's how I have it:

 

Horford, Antić, Muscala

Sap, Scott, Payne.

DMC, Thabo.

 

I know somewhere in this thread, somebody will develop a whole lot of Payne love because we drafted him but I don't think he's developed yet.  I don't think Scott's ready either but this is what we have.  Now of course, we could see Scott playing some Sf, however, it goes against my principle, you are what you guard.

 

So that's the question.  Who gets more playing time... Scott or Payne?

 

Are we winning or developing?

 

[DrReality]

By mid year Payne gets more pt. He can do more than Scott.

[macdaddy]

You just never know we guys like Payne.   I think we resigned Scott because we know he can play in the nba.   We don't know if Payne can yet.

[Diesel]

You just never know we guys like Payne.   I think we resigned Scott because we know he can play in the nba.   We don't know if Payne can yet.

 

 

I fall on this side of the equation.   Moreover, we can't miss the possibility that Scott may be used in trade?  Payne also.  I just think that these two guys being on the team is almost a log jam... especially if we bring back Muscala.

[macdaddy]

I fall on this side of the equation.   Moreover, we can't miss the possibility that Scott may be used in trade?  Payne also.  I just think that these two guys being on the team is almost a log jam... especially if we bring back Muscala.

 

Seems like the same deal with Mack and Scott right.   If Dennis or Payne show up then these guys may be valuable to other teams looking for bench help.   I think this is one thing about Ferry that most of us could agree on.   I definitely prefer having these capable young guys off the bench than the veteran retreads we used to rely on.

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

Payne will play primarily from the 5 and will get Pero's spot on the roster after next season.  Right now, he has Elton Brand's spot and will be played similarly (PnR, PnP, and rebounds).  Scott will play most of his minutes at the 3, but will need to develop more because he will be playing the 4 more as his career progresses.  Muscala will take Ayón's spot.

[AHF]

I was a bit surprised about Scott's resigning after the Payne pick as well.  I am not confident Payne can play center in the NBA but it will be interesting to see.  He can play at PF right away and will be part of that rotation.  I think Scott will continue to play primarily PF and very little SF.  Last year Scott played 90% of his minutes at PF (which was a significant increase after seeing more time at SF the prior season).

 

I do see them as competitive for the mostly the same minutes but time will tell.  I hope Scott shoots better from 3 next season and Payne has immediate value as a stretch big with more defensive intensity than Scott.

[Gray Mule]

Why either/or?

 

Bud has a process where he rotates players in and out,  a lot

of ball movement and a lot of movement of the players on the

floor.  This should give both players minutes on the floor.

 

We don't have that "super star" where everything revolves around him.

Rather, we have a lot of good players that we rotate in and out, keeping

fresh players on the floor at all times.

 

Scott & Paine.  Paine & Scott.  Part of the overall rotation.

 

Then, there is the possibility of a trade for one of them somewhere

down the road.

 

GO ALL ATLANTA TEAMS !!

[Packfill]

Why either/or?

 

Bud has a process where he rotates players in and out,  a lot

of ball movement and a lot of movement of the players on the

floor.  This should give both players minutes on the floor.

 

We don't have that "super star" where everything revolves around him.

Rather, we have a lot of good players that we rotate in and out, keeping

fresh players on the floor at all times.

 

Scott & Paine.  Paine & Scott.  Part of the overall rotation.

 

Then, there is the possibility of a trade for one of them somewhere

down the road.

 

GO ALL ATLANTA TEAMS !!

I think the simple reality is that, barring injury, Horford and Milsap will each play 30 minutes a night, leaving an aggregate of around 36 minutes at the C/PF spot for Antić, Payne, Scott and Muscala to fight over.  As, there just aren't alot of minute to go around so at least one, and probably two of these guys are not seeing regular minutes.

[MrMeltdown]

I agree once you pencil Horford and Sap in for 60 minutes a night I don't see much room for both Scott and Payne. I think Payne was another wasted pick. We love our spacing and Scott spaces the floor better than any reserve on our team.

 

Pencil in

 

Horford 30

Sap 30

Scott 18

 

The true battle is between Antić,Payne, and Muscala for 18 minutes a night.

 

By the way, I think trying to cover himself for free agents to be has been a fundamental flaw in the way Ferry drafts. He probably took Dennis because Teague was a free agent and he probably took Payne because Scott was a free agent and both are wasted picks.

[JohnnyCASH]

Scott is getting severely underrated easily top 5 pf off the bench in the nba last year

Edited August 15, 2014 by JohnnyCASH

[Peoriabird]

I agree once you pencil Horford and Sap in for 60 minutes a night I don't see much room for both Scott and Payne. I think Payne was another wasted pick.

 

By the way, I think trying to cover himself for free agents to be has been a fundamental flaw in the way Ferry drafts. He probably took Dennis because Teague was a free agent and he probably took Payne because Scott was a free agent and both are wasted picks.

I truly hope you don't think that Payne is a duplication of Mike Scott

[MrMeltdown]

I truly hope you don't think that Payne is a duplication of Mike Scott

Payne is nothing more than just another pick and pop big. So, yes he is a duplicate of Al, Paul, Scott, Antić, and Muscala but he is simply not more ready than Al, Sap, and Scott.

[thecampster]

Payne brings something to the table the other 3 don't, real shot blocking ability.  All 3 of the others can and do block shots, Payne is a bit more of shot blocker than all 3 and by extension a bit more useful in stopping penetration.  However, he needs a serious primer in personal and team D.  He is a good help defender/shot blocker but not a team concept guy and not big enough to D up one on one. Of all of these guys, only Al fits that model.

[Peoriabird]

Payne is nothing more than just another pick and pop big. So, yes he is a duplicate of Al, Paul, Scott, Antić, and Muscala but he is simply not more ready than Al, Sap, and Scott.

You're kidding right?  9'4" standing reach...38 inch vertical.  You don't think those dimensions screams rim protector and rebounder?  Mike Scott will never be the defender and rebounder that Payne can be.

[Peoriabird]

And on offense, how many Alley oops will Scott, Millsap and Horford  get compared to Payne.

[MrMeltdown]

You're kidding right?  9'4" standing reach...38 inch vertical.  You don't think those dimensions screams rim protector and rebounder?  Mike Scott will never be the defender and rebounder that Payne can be.

The guy was not a volume rebounder nor shot blocker in college despite those measurements

[Gray Mule]

So many duplicates and at every position!

 

At least, now, we don't have all our players the same size, as was the

dream of one former GM.

 

After the injuries our Hawks suffered last season, I have to believe that

duplication is a good thing, not a bad thing.

 

Sure, we're sad, even some are heart broken, that we didn't grab some of

those free agents floating around.  Truth is, either they didn't fit what we

wanted or they didn't want to play for Atlanta.

 

We can't force players, regardless of how good they are, to come to Atlanta.

We're too smart to try to force a square peg into a round hole.  If they can't

or wouldn't play the type of game that Bud wants, what were we supposed to

do?  Force Bud to change because we wanted a certain player or fire him?

 

I'm sure Ferry and Bud had some agreement about who was drafted and they

chose who they wanted.  The players they believed would fit in to what they

wanted for the Atlanta Hawks team.

 

Seems to me it comes down to a simple question.  Are we, the Hawk fans,

satisfied and optimistic about the job that Ferry and Bud or doing or do we

feel that it's time to fire these two and start over with someone else?

[Peoriabird]

The guy was not a volume rebounder nor shot blocker in college despite those measurements

I am guessing that you are concluding that what you do in college is what you do in the pros even though Paul Millsap didn't shoot 3's in college nor was Horford  a volume scorer in college etc.  Did Jordan lead the nation in scoring?  What about Derrick Rose?  You are flat out wrong if that is your assumption. 

[Peoriabird]

So many duplicates and at every position!

I don't see it..I don't think that any of the players mention have any similarities at all.  Payne is nothing like Scott or Muscala.  And certainly none of those players even remotely resembles Horford or Millsap.  Just nuts to even suggest such a thing!