Merged: Worried about Pero

[Plainview1981]

Huh?  What's your definition of well?  He hit 43% of his threes that month.  If he did that consistently he would not be a 15 minute a night guy.   In fact he'd be top 5 in the friggin nba in shooting.  So if that's your definition of shooting 'well' then you have extremely high expectations.

 

He's been right around 30% from 3 the rest of the time except for this last month.   But he only shot the ball 14 times for the whole month so this 'Pero is killing us' theory is bunk.    Find the other centers, much less backup centers, who are shooting 30% from 3.  I'm guessing the a couple of the ones you find make a lot more money and play a lot more and the others are nba unicorns.  

 

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/2585616/pero-Antić

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/2585616/year/2014/pero-Antić

 

Since Pero has been a Hawk, he has only shot the 3 ball well one month.

 

Jan 2014 is the only month where he shot over 32% in 3's.

 

Basically, he sucks at shooting most of the time. He is not Matt Bonner who is actually a stretch 5 that can shoot.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Hotlanta1981

[AtLaS]

I agree with you about Bud.  No one denies Pero hasn't shot well the last month and Bud adjusted accordingly, as did Pero by not jacking a lot of shots.    Put backs isn't what Bud asks Pero to do though.   Bud puts him on the perimeter for a reason.  You don't get many putbacks at the 3 point line.   That's not Pero's fault.   And his overall fg% compared to other centers is apples to oranges because 80% of his shots are from 3.

 

Pero cannot play inside.  Bud has no choice but to put him on the 3pt line.  That's the difference.  

 

You don't need your Center to be at the 3pt line to spread the floor, a solid midrange jumper will work just fine.  Brand gives us that plus some.  Hell, Moose gives us that.

[AHF]

He isn't nearly as good a 3pt shooter as Bonner but he is respected by defenses and stretches the floor for our other (more high volume) scorers and plays better defense than Bonner.  Look, he can hurt us at times with his shooting and the Indiana series is Exhibit A for that.  But as a 16 mpg player, he doesn't need to be a star either and he isn't nearly as easy to replace as some imply due to his defense and extreme perimeter shooting.

 

How many centers take 70% of their shots from 16 feet and out?  Not many.  I did a quick search to see how many centers are close to his 6.4 3pta/36 number (I looked for those at 6.0 3pta/36 and up) to approximate that for the 2011-12 through 2014-15 seasons and came up with the following names:

 

Pero Antić $1.25M

Channing Frye  $8.2M

 

That was it.  If  you start looking for guys who shoot less than 6 3pta/36 then the pool probably deepens by a small amount.  As far as guys who stretch the floor from the center position, it is not a deep pool.  

Edited March 3, 2015 by AHF

[DrReality]

Apparently he's been banged up

[AtLaS]

How many centers take 70% of their shots from 16 feet and out?  Not many.  I did a quick search to see how many centers are close to his 6.4 3pta/36 number (I looked for those at 6.0 3pta/36 and up) to approximate that for the 2011-12 through 2014-15 seasons and came up with the following names:

 

Pero Antić $1.25M

Channing Frye  $8.2M

 

That was it.  If  you start looking for guys who shoot less than 6 3pta/36 then the pool probably deepens by a small amount.  As far as guys who stretch the floor from the center position, it is not a deep pool.  

 

I don't think it's necessarily a good thing that our center takes 70% of his shots from three.  I'd much rather have a guy with midrange capability who is a better rebounder and can actually finish inside.

 

And, Channing Frye has the 3rd worst PER in the NBA for PF's.  He's terrible.  But, at least he shoots 39% from 3. 

[Plainview1981]

He isn't nearly as good a 3pt shooter as Bonner but he is respected by defenses and stretches the floor for our other (more high volume) scorers and plays better defense than Bonner.  Look, he can hurt us at times with his shooting and the Indiana series is Exhibit A for that.  But as a 16 mpg player, he doesn't need to be a star either and he isn't nearly as easy to replace as some imply due to his defense and extreme perimeter shooting.

 

How many centers take 70% of their shots from 16 feet and out?  Not many.  I did a quick search to see how many centers are close to his 6.4 3pta/36 number (I looked for those at 6.0 3pta/36 and up) to approximate that for the 2011-12 through 2014-15 seasons and came up with the following names:

 

Pero Antić $1.25M

Channing Frye  $8.2M

 

That was it.  If  you start looking for guys who shoot less than 6 3pta/36 then the pool probably deepens by a small amount.  As far as guys who stretch the floor from the center position, it is not a deep pool.  

 

Honestly, most anyone could probably do a better job of outside shooting than what Pero is doing right now. I know he is good inside of the defensive end and all of that... I don't think anyone really expects him to shoot 40% from outside. But he has to be respectable from out there. I think teams are now catching onto the fact that he really isn't that great of a shooter.

 

Worst of all, this guy is one injury away from playing heavy minutes again. 

[AHF]

I don't think it's necessarily a good thing that our center takes 70% of his shots from three.  I'd much rather have a guy with midrange capability who is a better rebounder and can actually finish inside.

 

And, Channing Frye has the 3rd worst PER in the NBA for PF's.  He's terrible.  But, at least he shoots 39% from 3. 

 

He doesn't take 70% of his shots from 3, but the worst shot in the game is the long midrange shot so I'm not sure why you would want more of that.  Elite midrange shooters have about the same EFG% on their long 2's that Pero has on his 3's.  

 

More to the point, you don't get the same floor spacing with someone hanging out at the free throw line that you do with someone hanging out outside the 3pt arc.  I think the value Bud sees in Pero is his floor spacing and defense.  There are a reasonable number of centers who could replace his defense but very few that could replace his floor spacing.  

 

Even with his "worst-case-scenario" series against Indy last year, the respect given to Pero's jumper still opened the floor for our guys.  That benefit was outweighed by his horrific shooting but most of the time he is just a subpar shooter rather than an historically bad one.

[Guest]

Y'all funny.

[AHF]

Y'all funny.

 

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little #*$&ed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to #*$&in' amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

[Guest]

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little #*$&ed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to #*$&in' amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

Just funny

[AtLaS]

He doesn't take 70% of his shots from 3, but the worst shot in the game is the long midrange shot so I'm not sure why you would want more of that.  Elite midrange shooters have about the same EFG% on their long 2's that Pero has on his 3's.  

 

More to the point, you don't get the same floor spacing with someone hanging out at the free throw line that you do with someone hanging out outside the 3pt arc.  I think the value Bud sees in Pero is his floor spacing and defense.  There are a reasonable number of centers who could replace his defense but very few that could replace his floor spacing.  

 

Even with his "worst-case-scenario" series against Indy last year, the respect given to Pero's jumper still opened the floor for our guys.  That benefit was outweighed by his horrific shooting but most of the time he is just a subpar shooter rather than an historically bad one.

 

I'd rather have a center who isn't standing on the 3pt line.  I'd rather have better rebounding and finishing inside with an average to good midrange jumper.

 

Sounds like many on this board prefer a 3pt guy.  I don't.

 

If Pero can get back to his 30% 3PT shooting than I am more than happy to give him the backup center slot.  The problem is that he has shown that he gets on these crazy cold streaks and really hurts the team (Indy last year, all of February this year).  I'm just hoping it doesn't happen again in the playoffs.  

 

In addition, with his minutes going down recently, his turnovers have gone up.  It isn't just his shooting at this point.

[AHF]

I'd rather have a center who isn't standing on the 3pt line.  I'd rather have better rebounding and finishing inside with an average to good midrange jumper.

 

Sounds like many on this board prefer a 3pt guy.  I don't.

 

Whether I do or not, Bud clearly values that from Pero.  If that is something our coach thinks he needs, then I give that some real credence.

[macdaddy]

One of my issues is that we are losing perspective on how 'bad' Pero's february was.   2-15 on 3s.   While that is an unbelievably sucky percentage, we've had plenty of guys shoot 2-15 in one game.  Yet we are on page 12 of this thread about it.

[Guest]

One of my issues is that we are losing perspective on how 'bad' Pero's february was. 2-15 on 3s. While that is an unbelievably sucky percentage, we've had plenty of guys shoot 2-15 in one game. Yet we are on page 12 of this thread about it.

That's why it's funny. When the guy guarding Pero refuses to leave the paint I'll worry.

Would I like Pero to hit more shots - yes. But the minutes he plays and the number of shot attempts per game he takes on offense doesn't outweigh the other things he does, particularly on defense which is what his strength is.

If he allowed his shooting slump to disengage him of his other responsibilities, I'd worry.

[benhillboy]

I'mma take a page outta Trillsap's book and simply say "47-12". And if Kanye can be a God, Bud damm sure is.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

somebody PLEASE tell me WHAT is it that Antić is doing that made the hawks feel like they didnt need payne. please, somebody, tell me SOMETHING......lmao.........this is ridiculous.........

 

Did you hear Payne say . . . "Give me that sh!t" . .  when he blocked the shot.

 

Oh boy.  If this dude turns out to be a player, while we're holding onto Antić for dear life, it would cast a little doubt on Bud's ability to be a GM.   The offensive and defensive plays he made in those two clips are something that Antić, nor Muscala, nor even Brand can do.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

So he's not shooting well, not rebounding, and turning the ball over, but he's not playing poorly on offense?  He must be the best screen setter of all time.

 

Regarding defense, I've already said that he's a good defender.  Not great.  Part of defense is rebounding and he sucks at that.  

 

I'm the best screen setter of all time, thank you very much.

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Come to think of it.... Pero has only shot the ball well for 1 month in his NBA career so far. That was Jan of 2014. 

 

He basically gets hot for a 7 - 10 game stretch about 2 times a year.  The rest of the time, his shooting is abysmal.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Find me a center who's shooting 35% from the field.  Or one who's averaging 3 rebounds in over 16 minutes per game.

 

Only Joffrey Lauvergne of the Denver Nuggets ( I know . . . who? ) is a center playing at least 10 minutes a game, that has a lower FG% than Antić.  And Joffrey has only played in 5 games.

 

Of the guys playing 16 minutes a game, he's the poorest rebounder at 3.0 a game.  You'd have to extend it down to 14 minutes a game, to find a center rebounding at a lower rate ( Jason Maxiel  . . at 2.9 per game )

[TheNorthCydeRises]

One of my issues is that we are losing perspective on how 'bad' Pero's february was.   2-15 on 3s.   While that is an unbelievably sucky percentage, we've had plenty of guys shoot 2-15 in one game.  Yet we are on page 12 of this thread about it.

 

2 - 15 on threes

4 - 15 on twos

 

6 - 30 overall ( 20% FG )

 

in only 117 minutes.  For those of you who act like he doesn't affect a game offensively, He's basically averaging a shot every 4 minute . . or 15 shots per 100 possessions.  That's a higher shot rate than DeMarre, Korver, Bazemore AND Sefolosha.