Korver biggest reason for Hawks decline, not the lost of DMC.

[Hawkmoor]

Last nights 16 point effort has proven that it is Korver, and NOT the lost of DMC that has the Hawks in a prolonged tailspin going back to the Allstar Break last year.  They HAD DMC on the roster after the allstar break, and were in a funk.  DMC'S lost does hurt. He DID provide more consistent scoring from the small forward position, but its Korver's jumpshot that REALLY makes this team go.   Korver MAKES THIS TEAM GO.  Not Milsap, Not Horford, Not Teague, Not Dennis. Korver is the KEY to this team.

Ive said this over and over. If the Hawks can HIT their shots, their lack of rebounding doesnt matter. Last nights game was a perfect example.  Dallas did well on the boards, but Teague AND Korver negated that.   

So, going forward, either Korver needs to be benched, replaced, or get his shot together, OR a rebounding center needs to be brought in.  I  personally dont think getting a legit small foward will change the Hawks, unless said small forward is a big time scorer.

Watch in this clip, how the big comes out to double team Korver on the wing, and it opens up the paint for a Scott layup:

 

 

You collapse the paint on defense, this what Korver did CONSISTENTLY at one time:

 

Edited February 2, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[NBASupes]

We know that Korver is the biggest factor. It's in the +/-.  He's not the best or close to it but he has that Bibby effect for us

Edited February 2, 2016 by NBASupes

[Hawkmoor]

34 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

We know that Korver is the biggest factor. It's in the +/-.  He's not the best or close to it but he has that Bibby effect for us

A LOT of people keep saying the Hawks need a small forward........

[Guest]

The defense can't collapse and rotate unless our PGs or anybody for that matter first drives the lane. It starts there.  That's how you get Kyle open and most effective. 

[Hawkmoor]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

The defense can't collapse and rotate unless our PGs or anybody for that matter first drives the lane. It starts there.  That's how you get Kyle open and most effective. 

Thats not the issue.  The Hawks get open shots, they just dont make them..

http://mikecheck.blog.myajc.com/2016/02/01/hawks-just-not-making-open-shots/

 

Edited February 2, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[HawkItus]

2 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

Last nights 16 point effort has proven that it is Korver, and NOT the lost of DMC that has the Hawks in a prolonged tailspin going back to the Allstar Break last year.  They HAD DMC on the roster after the allstar break, and were in a funk.  DMC'S lost does hurt. He DID provide more consistent scoring from the small forward position, but its Korver's jumpshot that REALLY makes this team go.   Korver MAKES THIS TEAM GO.  Not Milsap, Not Horford, Not Teague, Not Dennis. Korver is the KEY to this team.

Ive said this over and over. If the Hawks can HIT their shots, their lack of rebounding doesnt matter. Last nights game was a perfect example.  Dallas did well on the boards, but Teague AND Korver negated that.   

So, going forward, either Korver needs to be benched, replaced, or get his shot together, OR a rebounding center needs to be brought in.  I  personally dont think getting a legit small foward will change the Hawks, unless said small forward is a big time scorer.

Watch in this clip, how the big comes out to double team Korver on the wing, and it opens up the paint for a Scott layup:

 

 

You collapse the paint on defense, this what Korver did CONSISTENTLY at one time:

 

One question, why "lost" instead of "loss"?   Believe me I am not a language Nazi, but that sh*t irks me.

[Wretch]

I think everybody wants to find a nail in the tire, but the truth is that there is no one weakness to the Hawks.  Not really.  Moreso than probably any other team, our success was the result of all 5 guys on the court working in sync.  Obviously, if you have a part in the machine that's not optimal...then the machine is going to perform sub-optimal.

Korver has been off.  Teague has been inconsistent.  Horford has modified his game.  DMC is gone.  I think someone alluded to Pero's absence as a bit of an issue. Topping it all, the East has gotten better.  That's a lot of change for us to be expecting the same level of play.   

At the same time, we're not a bad team.  We're just mucked up in the middle.  I do agree though with how important Korver's shot is.  It's important in the way that our other main pieces bring something special, but we are clearly not the same without shooters creating space.  So count me in the camp that sees the biggest priority as a shooting wing.

[NBASupes]

If we had Carroll, we would be just as good as last year 

[Admin]

2 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

Last nights 16 point effort has proven that it is Korver, and NOT the lost of DMC that has the Hawks in a prolonged tailspin going back to the Allstar Break last year.  They HAD DMC on the roster after the allstar break, and were in a funk.  DMC'S lost does hurt. He DID provide more consistent scoring from the small forward position, but its Korver's jumpshot that REALLY makes this team go.   Korver MAKES THIS TEAM GO.  Not Milsap, Not Horford, Not Teague, Not Dennis. Korver is the KEY to this team.

Ive said this over and over. If the Hawks can HIT their shots, their lack of rebounding doesnt matter. Last nights game was a perfect example.  Dallas did well on the boards, but Teague AND Korver negated that.   

So, going forward, either Korver needs to be benched, replaced, or get his shot together, OR a rebounding center needs to be brought in.  I  personally dont think getting a legit small foward will change the Hawks, unless said small forward is a big time scorer.

Watch in this clip, how the big comes out to double team Korver on the wing, and it opens up the paint for a Scott layup:

 

 

You collapse the paint on defense, this what Korver did CONSISTENTLY at one time:

 

One question, why "lost" instead of "loss"?   Believe me I am not a language Nazi, but that sh*t irks me.

I thought it was language Nazr around these parts?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TheFuzz]

55 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

If we had Carroll, we would be just as good as last year 

Because he's a steady, consistent shooter. Teague + Korver dropping off + losing Carroll without replacing him is the biggest reason for our struggles. We need some consistency on the wing badly.

[Lurker]

58 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

If we had Carroll, we would be just as good as last year

This is absolutely hilarious. No. Not at all. Not even close. Having him MAYBE eeks out 2-3 more wins at this point in time but that's it. This team lost it's ability to play well in close games with Carroll still here, so the main issue in January still occurs.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Lurker said:

This is absolutely hilarious. No. Not at all. Not even close. Having him MAYBE eeks out 2-3 more wins at this point in time but that's it. This team lost it's ability to play well in close games with Carroll still here, so the main issue in January still occurs.

It's not totally out of the realm of possibility.  In fact, I'd say we'd probably have 2-3 less wins than last year at this point if he were still here (and not injured).  That's not to say that DMC is individually great.  It's more about righting the rotations.  Having an actual starter at the 3 instead of what we have floundering out there most games would make a significant difference.

[Lurker]

Just now, kg01 said:

It's not totally out of the realm of possibility.  In fact, I'd say we'd probably have 2-3 less wins than last year at this point if he were still here (and not injured).  That's not to say that DMC is individually great.  It's more about righting the rotations.  Having an actual starter at the 3 instead of what we have floundering out there most games would make a significant difference.

My point is 33-2 was a fluke, and we can't think of last season's team as a legit 60 win team. The team we saw for the most part was more a low 50s win team.

[Watchman]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

If we had Carroll, we would be just as good as last year 

Well, considering that he is recovering from surgery from injuries sustained while a member of the Hawks, (and thus it can't be argued that his injury would not have occurred had he not moved to Toronto), I don't see what difference would be made with him still here for this season.  He would be on the bench, and not helping us at all.

[SalvorMallow]

4 minutes ago, kg01 said:

It's not totally out of the realm of possibility.  In fact, I'd say we'd probably have 2-3 less wins than last year at this point if he were still here (and not injured).  That's not to say that DMC is individually great.  It's more about righting the rotations.  Having an actual starter at the 3 instead of what we have floundering out there most games would make a significant difference.

Thats crazy to think 1 player would give us 10 additional wins pre-allstar break.  We didn't lose KD on the wing, it was DMC.

[Duff_Man]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

If we had Carroll, we would be just as good as last year 

Well this also means you're subtracting Millsap, so no.

[NBASupes]

7 minutes ago, Duff_Man said:

Well this also means you're subtracting Millsap, so no.

We need them all

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, Lurker said:

My point is 33-2 was a fluke, and we can't think of last season's team as a legit 60 win team. The team we saw for the most part was more a low 50s win team.

There's no such thing as a 60-win fluke.  Does us winning 60 games mean we didn't need to keep working to improve?  No.  Were we going to stay at that level based on our offseason moves?  No.  That doesn't mean it was a fluke.

12 minutes ago, SalvorMallow said:

Thats crazy to think 1 player would give us 10 additional wins pre-allstar break.  We didn't lose KD on the wing, it was DMC.

It was a starter replaced with a non-starter.  That's a big difference.  It doesn't really matter what the names were.

[Admin]

18 minutes ago, Lurker said:

My point is 33-2 was a fluke, and we can't think of last season's team as a legit 60 win team. The team we saw for the most part was more a low 50s win team.

There's no such thing as a 60-win fluke.  Does us winning 60 games mean we didn't need to keep working to improve?  No.  Were we going to stay at that level based on our offseason moves?  No.  That doesn't mean it was a fluke.

12 minutes ago, SalvorMallow said:

Thats crazy to think 1 player would give us 10 additional wins pre-allstar break.  We didn't lose KD on the wing, it was DMC.

It was a starter replaced with a non-starter.  That's a big difference.  It doesn't really matter what the names were.

We were a fluke. Hardly any injuries, Korver having the best shooting season of all-time and we had 4 guys in the All Star game. You honestly think that was repeatable? Heck we couldn't even maintain that for a whole season let alone following seasons. The team we saw at the end of the season and the playoffs were who we really were. We were a solid 50 win team but we weren't a team that would win 60 games if we played the same opponents over and over again.

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[Hawkmoor]

2 hours ago, Wretch said:

I think everybody wants to find a nail in the tire, but the truth is that there is no one weakness to the Hawks.  Not really.  Moreso than probably any other team, our success was the result of all 5 guys on the court working in sync.  Obviously, if you have a part in the machine that's not optimal...then the machine is going to perform sub-optimal.

Korver has been off.  Teague has been inconsistent.  Horford has modified his game.  DMC is gone.  I think someone alluded to Pero's absence as a bit of an issue. Topping it all, the East has gotten better.  That's a lot of change for us to be expecting the same level of play.   

At the same time, we're not a bad team.  We're just mucked up in the middle.  I do agree though with how important Korver's shot is.  It's important in the way that our other main pieces bring something special, but we are clearly not the same without shooters creating space.  So count me in the camp that sees the biggest priority as a shooting wing.

I disagree.  The Hawks have the SAME weaknesses now, that they had WHEN they went on that undefeated streak. last year. THATS what SOME people are having a hard time wrapping their heads around.  Heck, the voters for the allstar game last year didnt even see it.  Korver got there because of a injury.  Some people in this thread DO see it.  

Korvers's HOT shooting COVERED UP all the weakneeses the Hawks have.  There were even periods DURING the streak that the Hawks weaknesses got exposed.  Thats why this team hasnt been the same since the allstar break last year.

Korver covered up a roster with a design flaw.  That flaw is Sap/Horford as  your bigs.   For the first time in his career, he was OPTION ONE on offense.  I dont care  how much the Hawks swung the ball around, Korver was option one on offense.  THAT enabled him to find a shooting groove he never had.  Once he calmed down, the Hawks havent been the same team.

Edited February 2, 2016 by Hawkmoor