Realistic offseason projections?

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, Jody23 said:

Even IF this situation makes it to free agency, re-signing both to max deals is still not the only option.

There is a chance it might be. I didn't say it was definite 

[Jody23]

The point I'm trying to make is they will NEVER be in a situation where they only have one option.  They can always decide not to re-sign a good (not great) point guard and his back-up both to max contracts just like they would have the option to do it.  I still doubt it ever gets to that point.

[NBASupes]

36 minutes ago, Jody23 said:

The point I'm trying to make is they will NEVER be in a situation where they only have one option.  They can always decide not to re-sign a good (not great) point guard and his back-up both to max contracts just like they would have the option to do it.  I still doubt it ever gets to that point.

I see Jeff as very good and can improve and Dennis as above average with an extremely high ceiling. I like having both players. 

[AHF]

Assuming we want to keep trying to win a championship in the shortterm and aren't tearing down to rebuild, I want no part of trading Teague for a pick around #20 in the draft.  Nothing about our recent draft says to me we will get good value for that.  The upside of Teague taking the next step or resigning and trading him to me is worth more even with the risk of him walking after next year than the #20 pick.

[macdaddy]

17 minutes ago, AHF said:

Assuming we want to keep trying to win a championship in the shortterm and aren't tearing down to rebuild, I want no part of trading Teague for a pick around #20 in the draft.  Nothing about our recent draft says to me we will get good value for that.  The upside of Teague taking the next step or resigning and trading him to me is worth more even with the risk of him walking after next year than the #20 pick.

That's my thing.  If we are going after a championship with Sap and Al then we shouldn't ship out our best PG for future assets.   At the point Dennis is actually better than Teague than i'm all for it.   As long as we can get by with building for the future AND winning now then let's do that, and that's what we are doing with these two.   But some point you have to choose.    For us we aren't forced to choose until 2017.

[marco102]

15 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

That's my thing.  If we are going after a championship with Sap and Al then we shouldn't ship out our best PG for future assets.   At the point Dennis is actually better than Teague than i'm all for it.   As long as we can get by with building for the future AND winning now then let's do that, and that's what we are doing with these two.   But some point you have to choose.    For us we aren't forced to choose until 2017.

Everyone keeps saying we HAVE to choose.  We don't!  We can keep both because we have their bird rights and the salary cap is going up.  We can choose to keep Teague as the starter and max him out.  Dennis is a restricted free agent in 2017 and we can match any offer he receives.  Look out when we have Dennis and Teague for the next 3 to 4 seasons.   Some here may be disappointed. 

[NBASupes]

37 minutes ago, AHF said:

Assuming we want to keep trying to win a championship in the shortterm and aren't tearing down to rebuild, I want no part of trading Teague for a pick around #20 in the draft.  Nothing about our recent draft says to me we will get good value for that.  The upside of Teague taking the next step or resigning and trading him to me is worth more even with the risk of him walking after next year than the #20 pick.

Or a top 10 pick for that measure. Honestly,  it's not even the pick that matters, it's who is available. 

[DS5]

1.  Re-sign Al
2.  Go hard after Durant. Second option, Harrison Barnes
3. Trade Teague, maybe for Jabari Parker or Okafor
4. Re-sign Kris and Kirk

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, DS5 said:

1.  Re-sign Al
2.  Go hard after Durant. Second option, Harrison Barnes
3. Trade Teague, maybe for Jabari Parker or Okafor
4. Re-sign Kris and Kirk

I would rather Noel over all of them outside of Al and Paul

Edited March 23, 2016 by NBASupes

[Guest]

22 hours ago, bumpyphish1 said:

1) Trade Teague on draft night--gain cap space, move on to Dennis who is as good now or will be next season.

This right here is the dumbest thing I've read today. You are going to trade a clearly underpaid asset for.....wait for it ......$8m in cap space. To wit, you'll have to pay $16m+ to get *any* player with comparable skills to Teague. Want a comparable point guard? Well that'll be more expensive than that.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, hawksfanatic said:

This right here is the dumbest thing I've read today. You are going to trade a clearly underpaid asset for.....wait for it ......$8m in cap space. To wit, you'll have to pay $16m+ to get *any* player with comparable skills to Teague. Want a comparable point guard? Well that'll be more expensive than that.

Just think about it like the night you had 16 shots of rumple...nuff said. Lol.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 hours ago, benhillboy said:

I've let go of my fandom but I respect you still going strong.  I still get a kick out of watching him though.  I'm amazed simply at how many dribbles he takes. How do you lose a game where Tony Allen shoots 12-12?  I wished Clarkson and Randle could be freed from LA, their potentials are very high.

Sorry for the awful, non-substantive, off-topic post, @bumpyphish1.  Won't happen again.  As far as the Hawks' offseason I got nothin to add after you hit the nail on everything.

( shrugs ) - He's the type of player that everyone says we need.  But because his name is Lance, people act like he's a screw up and can't ball.

All I know is that when Memphis made that trade for him, and got rid of Jeff Green, I knew Memphis had received the better player.  Everybody thought that the Clippers received a steal of a talent, while letting a malcontent go.  Well, now they know who won the deal.

I get as many Memphis games as I do Atlanta, and the people in Memphis LOVE that dude.   Here's a good article on Grizzlybearblues about the "Lance Problem"

 

http://www.grizzlybearblues.com/2016/3/18/11259148/lance-stephenson-memphis-grizzlies-analysis-free-agency-speculation

[Guest]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

Or a top 10 pick for that measure. Honestly,  it's not even the pick that matters, it's who is available. 

Can't emphasize this enough!!!

[Guest]

10 hours ago, BigDog90 said:

I highly doubt Durant and Batum would consider ATL. For Durant, it seems like GS, OKC and WAS are his options. Batum is highly likely to stay in CHA since they gave Clifford an extension.

Hawks overvalue their players. In a perfect world, I could imagine they want a top 5 pick for Teague. I think they'll hold on to him. So many young talented PGs, plus you got FAs like Conley on the market, just getting a top 15 pick for Teague would be great. 

Better to do that than accept fish heads and rice.  You trade for what you NEED not for what you can GET.

Who are the young talented free agent PGs? Jordan Clarkson

FA PGs include Conley, Rondo, Jennings, Deron Williams, Lin, Lawson, Mo Williams, Chalmers and Ish.   Where are you ranking Teague among that group?

Some of you place absolutely ZERO value on our players while pining away for some scrubs and are willing to take less that value for our players just to say 'look we made a trade'

 

Here a doozy from RealGM:

Hawks maybe take Burke, Lyles and a 2nd for Teague, Minny 2017 1st or our own 2016 1st and filler, maybe Mike Scott with 3.5 million TO.

[AHF]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

Or a top 10 pick for that measure. Honestly,  it's not even the pick that matters, it's who is available. 

Agreed - but I don't have confidence that our management will pick people out at that point in the draft.  When 19 other teams have passed on someone, they aren't a clear star in the making.  You need luck and exceptional scouting to hit on those guys even when they are available.

[Guest]

10 hours ago, BigDog90 said:

I highly doubt Durant and Batum would consider ATL. For Durant, it seems like GS, OKC and WAS are his options. Batum is highly likely to stay in CHA since they gave Clifford an extension.

Hawks overvalue their players. In a perfect world, I could imagine they want a top 5 pick for Teague. I think they'll hold on to him. So many young talented PGs, plus you got FAs like Conley on the market, just getting a top 15 pick for Teague would be great. 

I'd challenge you to take a look at the FAgent PG market this year (JBird laid it out for you).  Not only that.  Take a look at the prior offseason market and look at what those guys cost.

Also consider IIRC Jrue Holiday netted a top 10 pick.

11 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Better to do that than accept fish heads and rice.  You trade for what you NEED not for what you can GET.

Who are the young talented free agent PGs? Jordan Clarkson

FA PGs include Conley, Rondo, Jennings, Deron Williams, Lin, Lawson, Mo Williams, Chalmers and Ish.   Where are you ranking Teague among that group?

Some of you place absolutely ZERO value on our players while pining away for some scrubs and are willing to take less that value for our players just to say 'look we made a trade'

 

Here a doozy from RealGM:

Hawks maybe take Burke, Lyles and a 2nd for Teague, Minny 2017 1st or our own 2016 1st and filler, maybe Mike Scott with 3.5 million TO.

I saw that trade on RealGM and just SMDH.

Teague, 2 1st round picks AND filler for Burke (who has one leg out of the league and one leg on a banana peel) and Lyles (who's claim to fame is going head-to-head with 'Shannon' Frye and being blocked in the lineup by Favors).  Oh and a 2nd, can't forget the 2nd.  Get tha f*ck outta here with that nonsense.

[Diesel]

I'm not calling this a prediction, but this is what we should do.

Stay Pat.  Resign everybody.. even Kris.

Go out and sign Omri Casspi.

I want to see what we look like with a healthy Spitter.  I like Nicholas Batum, but I think Casspi is more realistic.   Plus, Casspi rebounds and shoots better.

I'm not trading Teague just to trade him.  IF you don't see the value int he 1-2 we have at PG or if you think that having Schröder starting with another PG backup, you're delusional.   Schröder still needs seasoning.  

I like the chemistry of our team.  Whereas before, I was thinking move Al for  a rebounder, We picked up Hump and I have liked how he effects our team.    i think having a lineup of:

Teague/Schro

Korver/Kent/THJr

Thabo/Casspi

Paul/Kris/Scott

Horf/Spitt/Walter

Could take us to the finals.

I'm not saying that I won't trade, but it would have to be a really good offer.

 

[AHF]

48 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I'd challenge you to take a look at the FAgent PG market this year (JBird laid it out for you).  Not only that.  Take a look at the prior offseason market and look at what those guys cost.

Also consider IIRC Jrue Holiday netted a top 10 pick.

I saw that trade on RealGM and just SMDH.

Teague, 2 1st round picks AND filler for Burke (who has one leg out of the league and one leg on a banana peel) and Lyles (who's claim to fame is going head-to-head with 'Shannon' Frye and being blocked in the lineup by Favors).  Oh and a 2nd, can't forget the 2nd.  Get tha f*ck outta here with that nonsense.

RealGM went down the tubes years ago.  The stupid ratio is really high.  @hawksfanatic would look like this if he spent all day there:

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Better to do that than accept fish heads and rice.  You trade for what you NEED not for what you can GET.

Who are the young talented free agent PGs? Jordan Clarkson

FA PGs include Conley, Rondo, Jennings, Deron Williams, Lin, Lawson, Mo Williams, Chalmers and Ish.   Where are you ranking Teague among that group?

Some of you place absolutely ZERO value on our players while pining away for some scrubs and are willing to take less that value for our players just to say 'look we made a trade'

 

Here a doozy from RealGM:

Hawks maybe take Burke, Lyles and a 2nd for Teague, Minny 2017 1st or our own 2016 1st and filler, maybe Mike Scott with 3.5 million TO.

RealGM is a piece of shit. That poster named tsherkin is a sucker to the greatest extent. 

Edited March 23, 2016 by NBASupes

[BigDog90]

10 hours ago, bumpyphish1 said:

Sorry, I don't mince words when it comes to senseless comments.

If the Hawks manage to go to back to back ECF's, Charlotte > ATL for Batum?  I think not.  Their roster isn't close and while Clifford is good, he's not Bud.  Batum can sign up to play in a system he's made for, play with 'Horf, 'Sap, (and Dennis--yes, he will be that good very soon)...or what....play with a young team whose best player is who....Kemba Walker?  Jeremy Lin (of late)?  Sorry, one of these teams is a piece away from challenging Cleveland for the EC.  It's not the Hornets, btw.  If pay is equal and he he gives a f about winning, he'd pick ATL in a heartbeat.

Lala land.  Can't afford both.  Closest scenario is keeping Teague one more year--I'd lay 3-1 odds he isn't back next year though.

Their roster is pretty comparable. The Hornets now with MKG out reminds me of the 2013 Hawks. Clifford is an elite coach. Batum even said in interviews how Clifford is the only coach that gave him this much responsibility, they literally run the offense through him and he's happy about Clifford resigning.

Hornets got a squad - Marvin is playing the best ball of his career, he reminds me of Millsap when he first came to the Hawks, Kemba is playing well and when MKG is healthy and well he elevates the play of the team. MKG is the equivalent of what Horford is to the Hawks, when he is healthy.  Lee has stepped in well for CHA. Zeller has improved. Big Al is nice off the bench. Frank, Lamb and Lin are solid off the bench as well. A healthy Hornets team would be a legit top 3 in the East.