THE TRADE DEADLINE - February 23rd at 3:00PM

[gurpilo]

1 hour ago, Sothron dijo:

We have several roster issues for a team that still has the longest playoff streak in the East. Zero back up PG and Center. A gaping chasm at SF. No real backup at PF since Bud won't play Hump.

Our team is literally Dennis, Paul, Dwight and THJR's good games. Toss in the odd Thabo scoring game and that's it. I mean...THAT IS IT. We can't win like this in the playoffs. We need a starting SF. We need a decent backup to PG, C and PF. That's too much for one trade deadline to fix.

Could not agree more, this is the point I am making. I would add some games from Baze, I mean he is not so bad, part of the problem is that he is playing out of position although I think THJR is playing better this season, contract season, take that into account

[Guest]

Chris Vivlamore 

 

✔ @CVivlamoreAJC

Although Paul Millsap is off market, I was told tonight the Hawks are being very active ahead of trade deadline.

[Guest]

Chris Vivlamore 

 

✔ @CVivlamoreAJC

To clarify, Hawks looking to be buyers at deadline. Want to add.

[Plainview1981]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Chris Vivlamore 

 

✔ @CVivlamoreAJC

Although Paul Millsap is off market, I was told tonight the Hawks are being very active ahead of trade deadline.

Everyone else is worthless. Yes, that includes Howard and Dennis.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

19 hours ago, sturt said:

Here's the thing that I think even Bud would agree with (... based on my conversations with him, of course *wink*)...

We can't go into the playoffs without a legitimate back-up to Dwight. We just can't. It's just too much. Moreover, he's got to start getting fewer minutes in March and April in the first place.

So, whether it's a replacement for Splitter or if for some reason there becomes an incredible belief that the Big Banana is suddenly ready to take the court and make all of his detractors eat the desk calendars on which they've been marking off his insurance payments... something HAS to happen on that front. Again, trust me ( :D ), Bud gets that.

He also gets that he's got similar situation at PG, though not as acute at this stage simply because the two incumbents are young and really can use all this floor time they've been getting anyways. Same thing, though... there's got to be some moderation as the regular season winds down so that they're both charged and ready to put their best performances of the year forward in April and May, and dare I say June. (Don't laugh, unless you can tell me you saw January 2015 coming from a mile away.)

On both fronts, you can get away with very average players because you're not actually going to be asking them to log a whole lot of minutes anyway. 

But I think at one of those spots, and two if it becomes an option, Bud looks to go get a player with some potential to be more than that,... a scoring PG/SG type (thus shaving some minutes off Ruder and Delaney's docket primarily, though depending on who it is, maybe pushing THjr to some SF minutes)... and/or... a post guy who has a credible 3-shot in his arsenal (likely shaving minutes both Dwight's and Moose's expected load).

Trading partner candidates begin with whoever's still in line to deal with NYK for Melo... with us being a 3rd team in the deal if what NYK isn't willing to take is a fit, after all, to one of the roles above. (Jamal interrupts... "You mean, me?"... I suppose it's plausible, Jamal. )

After that, if that's a no-go, then you look at the next line forming, which is the sellers' line... but more precisely, those in the sellers' line who are reported to be looking to reduce salary. There's several of those, some of whom have already begun that process.

A scoring PG/SG type

 

 

Before you LOL . . . he's better than Delaney.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

A scoring PG/SG type

Before you LOL . . . he's better than Delaney.

[sturt]

I greatly appreciate what NorthCyde contributes to our discussions here, honestly. I sometimes agree, sometimes don't.

I also greatly appreciate kg01's capacity to illustrate exactly what I'm thinking sometimes. Like, just now. ;)  (... I forget, was that Mr. Dunder ,or Mr. Mifflin?)

This one, I just close the door, and don't even bother to engage the premise.

Zooming out to the bigger picture... give this team a 8-10 game winning streak, and watch all this ragging on individual players as-if douchebags subsides. And that's completely plausible.

Folks, we all know this, but we have to constantly remind ourselves... this roster had some serious trauma to it.

You don't go from Horf to Dwight and added to that replace an All-Star PG on the roster with a rookie SF who doesn't even get to play the first half of the season, and then added to that, see Korver lose something and regress... you don't do all of that, and yet still play above .500, and come away a pessimist.

At least, I don't.

Give Prince 20 games @ 20 min per... and let's see if, after that, there's not some progress.

Further, where this thread is concerned, get yourself a Lou Williams kind of threat to take some minutes at PG and less so at SG... and/or get yourself a Speights as a third-party in a Melo-to-LAC trade... 

Things change and sometimes violently so between what one sees in a team before the break and after the break. That's not fluff, that's history.

Play Prince. Get some minutes-eaters for your bench at the 1 and/or 5, and if you can, even get a difference maker at one or both of those spots.

Then, let's see how things look. Only then.

[Lurker]

Prince was pretty bad in his minutes in the first half of the season.

[sturt]

Whatever you thought of Prince to-date... the current PG as a rookie was far worse. Far.

Fan observations are the nectar of a message board, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and start basing conclusions on a rookie's sporadic play (at best) in the first half of a season, please. Please.

I said it another thread, all I needed to hear this week was that Prince played noticeably good defense in a winning cause vs Portland the other night. Few doubt his offense will be there, but many want to see him play defense, and legitimately so. Cause for optimism is there.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

44 minutes ago, sturt said:

I greatly appreciate what NorthCyde contributes to our discussions here, honestly. I sometimes agree, sometimes don't.

 

Thank you.

One thing about me though, I come into any discussion ARMED.   Whether you agree or disagree, I'm going to come with enough facts and if possible, video evidence, to let you know what my view of the situation is.

 

 

 

[macdaddy]

We won 60 games because we had 2 starting wings who could hit the 3 ball.   But we couldn't rebound

Now we are 25th in 3 point %,   Here's our competition:

2. Cleveland

5. Washington

6. Indy

8 Toronto

10. Boston

[macdaddy]

And in our 60 win season we were 2nd in the league

[AUhawksfan]

27 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

We won 60 games because we had 2 starting wings who could hit the 3 ball.   But we couldn't rebound

Now we are 25th in 3 point %,   Here's our competition:

2. Cleveland

5. Washington

6. Indy

8 Toronto

10. Boston

That actually makes it even more impressive we've managed the record we have considering that. And shows how much better we could be with good shooting. 

[macdaddy]

1 hour ago, AUhawksfan said:

That actually makes it even more impressive we've managed the record we have considering that. And shows how much better we could be with good shooting. 

We have a good record because we are beating the bad teams of the league.   A victory over the spurs was our last impressive win on 1/1. Teams that play well on both ends are beating us badly and consistently.     We have to try to make some kind of move if not for this season then for next.   

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, AUhawksfan said:

That actually makes it even more impressive we've managed the record we have considering that. And shows how much better we could be with good shooting. 

Yep but it's not with this core. 

[NBASupes]

If we trade anymore more than a late 2nd for Lou and maybe Splitter, it's too much.

[sturt]

On 2/15/2017 at 2:29 PM, sturt said:

Here's the thing that I think even Bud would agree with (... based on my conversations with him, of course *wink*)...

We can't go into the playoffs without a legitimate back-up to Dwight. We just can't. It's just too much. Moreover, he's got to start getting fewer minutes in March and April in the first place.

So, whether it's a replacement for Splitter or if for some reason there becomes an incredible belief that the Big Banana is suddenly ready to take the court and make all of his detractors eat the desk calendars on which they've been marking off his insurance payments... something HAS to happen on that front. Again, trust me ( :D ), Bud gets that.

He also gets that he's got similar situation at PG, though not as acute at this stage simply because the two incumbents are young and really can use all this floor time they've been getting anyways. Same thing, though... there's got to be some moderation as the regular season winds down so that they're both charged and ready to put their best performances of the year forward in April and May, and dare I say June. (Don't laugh, unless you can tell me you saw January 2015 coming from a mile away.)

On both fronts, you can get away with very average players because you're not actually going to be asking them to log a whole lot of minutes anyway. 

But I think at one of those spots, and two if it becomes an option, Bud looks to go get a player with some potential to be more than that,... a scoring PG/SG type (thus shaving some minutes off Ruder and Delaney's docket primarily, though depending on who it is, maybe pushing THjr to some SF minutes)... and/or... a post guy who has a credible 3-shot in his arsenal (likely shaving minutes both Dwight's and Moose's expected load).

Trading partner candidates begin with whoever's still in line to deal with NYK for Melo... with us being a 3rd team in the deal if what NYK isn't willing to take is a fit, after all, to one of the roles above. (Jamal interrupts... "You mean, me?"... I suppose it's plausible, Jamal. )

After that, if that's a no-go, then you look at the next line forming, which is the sellers' line... but more precisely, those in the sellers' line who are reported to be looking to reduce salary. There's several of those, some of whom have already begun that process.

Pragmatically, what I think is most likely in answer to this synopsis...

- Bryce Cotton will be picked up as a FA immediately after his Perth team's playoff run finishes in the next 2 weeks... ie, there's your scoring PG/SG.

- Spencer Hawes is excess baggage in MIL (hasn't played a game yet since the trade), but would be a durable (no games missed to injury this season) offensive piece in the tradition of Pero Antic, only younger (couldn't believe the guy isn't even 30 yet, seems like he's been in the league forever), and, imo, substantially better overall.

- Added to the mix... NOP has some excess baggage at PF with their pick-up of Motijunas earlier, and either Dante Cunningham or Terrance Jones (an apparent dark horse favorite of some 'round here) would seem to be somewhat movable. The question then becomes whether they're able to strike a deal with Philly for Okafor, as has been often rumored lately. If not--since it seems there's no reason for optimism at this point that Mike Scott's health is going to be much better than Tiago's--it would make a lot of sense to effort to replace him with one of these guys.

 

"But does that actually do anything tangible to raise our trajectory for 2017?"

I would say yes... though, yeah, you knew I would.

I would say yes mainly because if you can add two pieces to the roster who can give you a boost on offense, that's cranking the lever of the core issue for this year's roster. Start shooting well as a team enough to vault out of the poorest class quintile (#26 currently per RealGM) offensive rating to the even just the middle class quintile (ie, #13-#18), and yeah, I think it makes a difference. And of course, I've already spoken to how, just having an NBA caliber center of some kind standing ready to give Dwight more rest over these last 25-ish games portends good things for us in the playoffs.

 

[Guest]

Bryce Cotton and Spencer Hawes ain't gonna do it. It's a very weak move. If ur gonna make a move then stop being a pu$$y and make a real mutha******$ move!

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Spud2Nique said:

Bryce Cotton and Spencer Hawes ain't gonna do it. It's a very weak move. If ur gonna make a move then stop being a pu$$y and make a real mutha*&**$ move!

Yeah, we're double-teamin @sturton this one.

Bryce Cotton?  Please.  He's in AUS for a reason.  That doesn't moov the meter, sir.

Spencer f'n Hawes?  How bout we not continue the illusion that he's an NBA player.  Mmkay, thanks.

NO is still in the playoff hunt.   They're not jetissoning pieces.  They'll be looking to add just like we are.

I'm SMH at you, sturt.  Bad job all around.  Go back to the dungeon, come back with a better trade.

[sturt]

Speaking for myself (obviously),

1. I just don't see a high likelihood that our expiriings are going to net that much in return. (I'd love to be wrong, of course.)

2. I just don't see a high likelihood that the only other piece that everyone thinks ought to be readily available is all that readily available--ie, Bazemore aint' goin' nowhwere, imo.

3. Cotton is a solid 3 pt threat, but not the exceptional one I'd like to see us add. Having said that, Barea, who I'd proposed in the Bogut trade on the trade forum, is approximately an equivalent threat to Cotton. And, again, reports were that we offered Cotton an opportunity before we signed Neal and it's not all that hard to conjecture that if he was the first option before, but that he wanted to finish what he started in Australia (probably b/c we weren't offering more than a 10-day contract), he's likely still about that highly regarded as he leads his team to the finals down under.

Just sayin.

4. Hawes, imo, is that under-rated guy who everybody looks up, later, and says, "Why did we think he wasn't going to be this good?"

Tailor-fit for the Hawks offense, if you ask me, and yet, couldn't be a better situation in terms of price.

5. I would be surprised to see them bother to pursue either Jones or Cunningham a Scott replacement because I think Hump and Moose are ticketed to divide  up those minutes anyhow if a viable back-up C is acquired... first, as said, b/c one or both could be headed for PHI, but second, it seems there'd have to be a draft pick involved, and we know how Budcox values draft picks... particularly given the prospect that you're only dealing for the new player's services for 25-or-so games.