49 years, 0 championships

[Thomas]

That was indeed a salary dump but also Manning had put up over twenty per game with the Clippers the year before and close to it the year before that when we traded for him. Was averaging around there at the time of the trade. He never averaged those numbers again for a whole season. A big part of that painful memory was the loss of Nique but also it was for a guy that simply dumped us after such a big risk investment in that trade for us. A very low point for us.

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, Thomas said:

That was indeed a salary dump but also Manning had put up over twenty per game with the Clippers the year before and close to it the year before that when we traded for him. Was averaging around there at the time of the trade. He never averaged those numbers again for a whole season. A big part of that painful memory was the loss of Nique but also it was for a guy that simply dumped us after such a big risk investment in that trade for us. A very low point for us.

Worst day of my bball fanhood...Feb 24th at 6:20 pm pacific time...20 minutes after the deadline had passed I heard headline sports of CNN headline news and Van Earl Wright reported the entire sporting news and at the very end said the Hawks trade longtime player Dominique Wilkins to the Clippers for Danny Manning...:-( I had ordered a Nique Hawks jersey a month before and it was lagging in the mail...it came in mid march as a Clippers #21 Nique jersey...I still have it in my closet as a reminder of why Babcock and Kasten suck and why I'm a pushover and too lazy to return things..lol

[Guest]

Next worst day...Jan 28 1992 Hawks hosting Sixers at the Omni and Nique tears his achillies...smh

[Thomas]

Jeepers, these memories are getting worse and worse this morning.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Jeepers, these memories are getting worse and worse this morning.

Lol my bad...I really should gotten rid of that jersey a lot time ago....sometimes I think that jersey in my closet is haunting me in my life and haunting the Hawks in winning a title....superstitious a bit..

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Jeepers, these memories are getting worse and worse this morning.

Sorry I came out as Debbie today...

[Thomas]

7 hours ago, Spud2Nique said:

Lol my bad...I really should gotten rid of that jersey a lot time ago....sometimes I think that jersey in my closet is haunting me in my life and haunting the Hawks in winning a title....superstitious a bit..

Remember seeing Harper and a skinner Bo playing with Nique and it was entertaining but just the same was really still pissed about the trade for such a long time. Didn't get to see Nique on the court much anymore beyond that point.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Remember seeing Harper and a skinner Bo playing with Nique and it was entertaining but just the same was really still pissed about the trade for such a long time. Didn't get to see Nique on the court much anymore at that point.

Ya I remember him coming back a month later and torching us for around 40 points in a Clippers win...prolly one of the few times I was happy that we lost. We deserved it. Lol.

[hawkman]

1 hour ago, Spud2Nique said:

Ya I remember him coming back a month later and torching us for around 40 points in a Clippers win...prolly one of the few times I was happy that we lost. We deserved it. Lol.

Man it was so weird seeing him in a Clippers jersey during that game. I was still in school and remember checking box scores and watching his highlights on Sportscenter as he lit teams up for the rest of the season. That trade defied all logic for a team that was first in the Eastern Conference. Manning basically played like Marvin Williams for the Hawks until his last Playoff game where he scored 35(?) points in a loss. Then he left us high and dry. This franchise got the results it deserved.  

[AUhawksfan]

Plus, Michael Jordan was playing baseball when the trade was made. 

Why would you decide to retool when things are up for the taking in the east?  Sometimes the window is small but we had our chance. Still a head scratcher to this day. 

Can you imagine if Lebron decided to leave the NBA for a year hiatus during our 60 win season and we decided to trade Paul at the All-Star break?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

9 minutes ago, AUhawksfan said:

Plus, Michael Jordan was playing baseball when the trade was made. 

Why would you decide to retool when things are up for the taking in the east?  Sometimes the window is small but we had our chance. Still a head scratcher to this day. 

Can you imagine if Lebron decided to leave the NBA for a year hiatus during our 60 win season and we decided to trade Paul at the All-Star break?

They were afraid that they wouldn't be able to re-sign Nique.  He was reportedly asking for a 7 mill a year deal, if I remember correctly, for at least 3 - 4 years.  He ended up signing with Boston the next year at 3 years for 11 million.  But he left Boston after just 1 year to go to Greece

The big thing was that Lenny and Nique didn't mix well, because Nique was still in the "I gotta get mine" type of mindset to help the team win, while Lenny wanted more of a team concept.  From that standpoint, Manning fit Lenny's team concept better.   Better rebounder and passer and defender.  Nique was a more versatile and explosive scorer, but becoming highly erratic with his scoring.   He'd have 30 point games, but then turn around and have 19 point games shooting 5 - 18 FG.

He was scoring the ball ( 24 ppg ), but only shooting 43% FG and 31% 3FG.

Still the trade was inexcusable, especially when you realize that Manning was also a free agent going into that summer.

[thecampster]

51 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Still the trade was inexcusable, especially when you realize that Manning was also a free agent going into that summer.

This!

[Sothron]

I hate rehashing this but for everyone blasting Babcock you are unaware or forgetting key points:

Nique wanted a metric ton of money as a free agent. Babcock correctly saw that Nique wasn't the same player and we would be stuck with a bad deal if he gave in to public pressure. Look at Nique's stats the years after that season. Horrible. One ok season (kinda?) on a Spurs team blatantly tanking to get Duncan.

The cap space we saved on Nique was used to sign Deke. Never forget that.

Danny Manning gave Babcock an oral agreement he would resign before they made the trade. Manning literally gave up millions on the table (thank God) to go take way, way less to sign in Phoenix where he promptly kept tearing his knees out and was never the same.

Babcock didn't trade Nique because he wanted to ruin the franchise. I always stand by that trade decision.

[macdaddy]

4 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I hate rehashing this but for everyone blasting Babcock you are unaware or forgetting key points:

Nique wanted a metric ton of money as a free agent. Babcock correctly saw that Nique wasn't the same player and we would be stuck with a bad deal if he gave in to public pressure. Look at Nique's stats the years after that season. Horrible. One ok season (kinda?) on a Spurs team blatantly tanking to get Duncan.

The cap space we saved on Nique was used to sign Deke. Never forget that.

Danny Manning gave Babcock an oral agreement he would resign before they made the trade. Manning literally gave up millions on the table (thank God) to go take way, way less to sign in Phoenix where he promptly kept tearing his knees out and was never the same.

Babcock didn't trade Nique because he wanted to ruin the franchise. I always stand by that trade decision.

But how many mistakes are in that decision?  An oral agreement.   You're going to part with your superstar for a handshake?   And what if Manning did sign?  Even if he didn't have injury issues and stayed a healthy player was he a difference maker?  Not really AND he would have eaten up the cap with his contract.   Not to mention fans still would have been pissed.   So even if it panned out the way Babcock expected it's not that good of result.   

[Dejay]

The only time you make such a move is 1) if your team isn't contending for a title and 2) you can move your aging franchise player to a team in the running in order to get a shot at a ring in exchange for some younger but talented players who can help you rebuild. The Hawks did neither dealing Nique for Manning, who publicly stated on air that Atlanta wasn't one of the teams on his list that he'd sign with even after the trade was made.

You only make that kind of move for a second or third wheel; I was dying for them to move Stacey 'please don't make me shoot the ball' Augmon instead. Even if Manning had stayed, short of him leading the Hawks to the ECFs and beyond, he would've been unfairly compared to Dominique's roll of highlight moments. He loses that contest all day long...

[Thomas]

The guy whose word you couldn't trust then, the one and only Danny Manning, is now the head coach of a Baptist private school with an astute roundball lineage among many, many other qualities, Demon Deacons as it were. Hmmm.

[Sothron]

3 hours ago, macdaddy said:

But how many mistakes are in that decision?  An oral agreement.   You're going to part with your superstar for a handshake?   And what if Manning did sign?  Even if he didn't have injury issues and stayed a healthy player was he a difference maker?  Not really AND he would have eaten up the cap with his contract.   Not to mention fans still would have been pissed.   So even if it panned out the way Babcock expected it's not that good of result.   

You can't blame the guy for doing something and then blame him for things that he had no control over if they  happened or not. Trading Nique was the smartest decision to make at the time Babcock made the decision.

[thecampster]

3 hours ago, macdaddy said:

But how many mistakes are in that decision?  An oral agreement.   You're going to part with your superstar for a handshake?   And what if Manning did sign?  Even if he didn't have injury issues and stayed a healthy player was he a difference maker?  Not really AND he would have eaten up the cap with his contract.   Not to mention fans still would have been pissed.   So even if it panned out the way Babcock expected it's not that good of result.   

You lost me at oral.  tee hee hee!!!

[macdaddy]

14 hours ago, Sothron said:

You can't blame the guy for doing something and then blame him for things that he had no control over if they  happened or not. Trading Nique was the smartest decision to make at the time Babcock made the decision.

That's what i'm saying though.   I'm blaming him for making a deal that even if everything went ideally was still a bad deal.   

[Sothron]

6 hours ago, macdaddy said:

That's what i'm saying though.   I'm blaming him for making a deal that even if everything went ideally was still a bad deal.   

But...it wasn't. We got rid of an aging Nique, avoided paying Manning when his knees kept blowing up on him and used the cap space from both of them to get Deke. It is one of the very few times in Hawks history that something actually worked out great for us for a change.