Its Official...Travis Schlenk is the New Hawks GM

[NBASupes]

3 hours ago, thecampster said:

So let me get this straight. You think a player who has 3...count em, 3 total years in the league has peaked?  So last year, Dennis peaked?  Al Horford peaked in 2010? Kobe peaked at 22?  Hardaway has 62 career NBA starts and you believe he is done developing? Its a new WTF moment with you and Lurker daily.

At the exact same age, term of development, Kent Bazemore averaged 5.2 points per game. Golden State and the Lakers both gave up on him the year before. Last year he averaged 11 points and got a $15 million dollar contract. But you are trying to tell me that Hardaway's ceiling is maxed and he isn't going to get more than 12 million after scoring 14.5 / game last year. Keep the opinions coming. They are fascinating. I especially like the ones every year where you swear you have inside knowledge about who the Hawks are acquiring at the trade deadline.

It's the stage of development more than age itself. If they have fit, they can continue to improve into their 30s. That's the part you do not understand. Lou Williams could be on this team for 5 years and not improve.

[Peoriabird]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

It's the stage of development more than age itself. If they have fit, they can continue to improve into their 30s. That's the part you do not understand. Lou Williams could be on this team for 5 years and not improve.

The same things were said about Jeff Teague and every year Teague improved. Hardaway made a big leap this past season and so did Dennis.  I see no reason for them not to continue to get better.

[hazer]

5 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Honestly, I do not mind trading Dennis for a top 5 pick in this draft. He is a C+/B- level player with A- talent but him getting there could be very hard and even if we built the team around him, he needs a lot to fit his game and will it be enough to contender with in today's NBA.

Trade up for Fox or Frank. 

Draft Giles or Patton

Draft another big with 31. 

 

 

3 hours ago, Spud2Nique said:

Fox is a top 5 guy but Frank is ranging in most mocks between 8-11. I actually think I prefer Frank to Fox. I think we should keep Dennis unless we got a no brainer deal for him. 

 

Dennis is a fierce competitor and he's gonna continue to grow. I love the hype of moving up into the top 5 or 10 but I don't think it would be quite worth the assets we would have to give up for the player. If it was Fultz or Ball it would be a no brainer but I dunno about Fox and Frank.

 

Personally I'd stick with our #19 pick because there will be a solid player available at that slot that we could groom with Bud and Schlenk is known for his recognition of talent so if anything we should probably trade down if we like a guy that we think might drop like a Caleb or a Rabb. 

 

I appreciate your your passion for a quick tank though. I really wanna have a young star or multiple young stars quickly as well.

We good with The Menace, only 23 and has that Rhine fire that can't be taught. If you're gonna move up into the Top 10, Jonathan Isaac as our PF of the future is the pick. Tall, long, fast, shooting touch. Comparisons to the next Durant.

[KB21]

5 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Honestly, I do not mind trading Dennis for a top 5 pick in this draft. He is a C+/B- level player with A- talent but him getting there could be very hard and even if we built the team around him, he needs a lot to fit his game and will it be enough to contender with in today's NBA.

Trade up for Fox or Frank. 

Draft Giles or Patton

Draft another big with 31. 

 

You really do want to lose for several years.

[Guest]

Back on topic of the new GM, I found this snippet interesting....,,

Quote

Tim Kawakami: Note on Travis Schlenk’s connection to Atlanta’s set up: Schlenk was part of the process when GSWs interviewed Mike Budenholzer in 2011. That was when GSWs ended up hiring Mark Jackson, but Schlenk and Budenholzer had a lot of common ground during that process.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Peoriabird said:

The same things were said about Jeff Teague and every year Teague improved. Hardaway made a big leap this past season and so did Dennis.  I see no reason for them not to continue to get better.

This I remember, a certain someone (Supes) argued that Teague had no chance to get better (wanted to start Dennis as a rookie).

[NBASupes]

18 minutes ago, KB21 said:

You really do want to lose for several years.

Yes. I want to build a new house with a much better foundation 

[KB21]

1 minute ago, NBASupes said:

Yes. I want to build a new house with a much better foundation 

You must have really enjoyed 1999-2007 then.

[NBASupes]

Just now, KB21 said:

You must have really enjoyed 1999-2007 then.

No, because we had shit management, terrible front office. Awful decision making. We would have been the Kings if it wasn't for Joe Johnson wanting to come to Atlanta because he wanted to get paid above all.

[hazer]

Menace/Yes-Way-José

THJr/daFro

Fresh Prince/Isaac

Ilyasovavichkov/Isaac

D12/Hump

 

Send DeLamey, Blaze, Thaboo, Sap, Moose, Dun-please-leavey, and Smelley packing. Lock the candy bars away from Dwight, put him on a ginseng regimen, run him thru nothing but PnR drills all practice. Move up in the draft and snag Jonathan Isaac with the 7th pick. There's you're soft tank, run with our youth (plus Dwight). Then draft/trade/FA our future C next. Haven't even figured out what to do with the Sap money yet. This is an extremely intriguing scenario...

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2017 by hazer

[KB21]

58 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

No, because we had shit management, terrible front office. Awful decision making. We would have been the Kings if it wasn't for Joe Johnson wanting to come to Atlanta because he wanted to get paid above all.

It's not the management that is the issue.  It's the fact that you bottom out and rely upon the draft to rebuild that is the issue.

[NBASupes]

43 minutes ago, KB21 said:

It's not the management that is the issue.  It's the fact that you bottom out and rely upon the draft to rebuild that is the issue.

This is your take, not mines. 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

It's not the management that is the issue.  It's the fact that you bottom out and rely upon the draft to rebuild that is the issue.

Doesn't matter if you acquire those lottery picks by trade or by bad record but you better play if you want to ring up.

 

NBA Finals MVPs

Bold = Drafted in lottery (or traded for the pick during the draft) by the team winning the finals

Italics = Drafted by the team winning the finals

No bold or italics means FA.

1990 Zeke - Drafted by Pistons #2 overall

1991 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1992 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1993 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1994 Hakeem - Drafted by Rockets #1 overall

1995 Hakeem - Drafted by Rockets #1 overall

1996 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1997 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1998 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1999 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2000 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2001 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2002 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2003 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2004 Billups - Drafted #3 but acquired as a FA

2005 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2006 Wade - Drafted by Heat #5 overall

2007 Parker - Drafted by Spurs but outside of lottery

2008 Pierce - Drafted by Celtics #10 overall

2009 Kobe - Drafted by Lakers #13 overall

2010 Kobe - Drafted by Lakers #13 overall

2011 Dirk - Drafted by Mavs #9 overall

2012 Lebron - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2013 Lebron - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2014 Kawhi - Drafted by Spurs one spot out of lottery

2015 Iggy - Drafted #9 but acquired via trade

2016 Lebron - Drafted by Cavs #1

2017 ???

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, AHF said:

Doesn't matter if you acquire those lottery picks by trade or by bad record but you better play if you want to ring up.

 

NBA Finals MVPs

Bold = Drafted in lottery (or traded for the pick during the draft) by the team winning the finals

Italics = Drafted by the team winning the finals

No bold or italics means FA.

1990 Zeke - Drafted by Pistons #2 overall

1991 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1992 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1993 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1994 Hakeem - Drafted by Rockets #1 overall

1995 Hakeem - Drafted by Rockets #1 overall

1996 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1997 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1998 Jordan - Drafted by Bulls #3 overall

1999 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2000 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2001 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2002 Shaq - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2003 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2004 Billups - Drafted #3 but acquired as a FA

2005 Duncan - Drafted by Spurs #1 overall

2006 Wade - Drafted by Heat #5 overall

2007 Parker - Drafted by Spurs but outside of lottery

2008 Pierce - Drafted by Celtics #10 overall

2009 Kobe - Drafted by Lakers #13 overall

2010 Kobe - Drafted by Lakers #13 overall

2011 Dirk - Drafted by Mavs #9 overall

2012 Lebron - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2013 Lebron - Drafted #1 but acquired as a FA

2014 Kawhi - Drafted by Spurs one spot out of lottery

2015 Iggy - Drafted #9 but acquired via trade

2016 Lebron - Drafted by Cavs #1

2017 ???

All of them that accquired via FA that were their team best player are marquee franchises which we are not. The truth is,  you need a high pick or you need someone doing a Kobe. Saying they are not playing for no one else but the Hawks. That hasn't happened and likely never will.

[KB21]

Notice the trend.  Prior to the one and done fad that we currently have, it was easier to get legitimate top level talent at the top of the draft.  Jordan, Hakeem, Ewing.....all those guys were established guys at the college level.  There was very little projection to what they could do.  You weren't clinging to the hope that you could develop their skill level and develop their game mentally to become a star. 

Today, you have guys like Andrew Wiggins, DeAngelo Russell, and Brandon Ingram going in the top of the draft, players who are clearly flawed but are being overdrafted because teams overvalue youth and perceived upside rather than basketball skill level.

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Notice the trend.  Prior to the one and done fad that we currently have, it was easier to get legitimate top level talent at the top of the draft.  Jordan, Hakeem, Ewing.....all those guys were established guys at the college level.  There was very little projection to what they could do.  You weren't clinging to the hope that you could develop their skill level and develop their game mentally to become a star. 

Today, you have guys like Andrew Wiggins, DeAngelo Russell, and Brandon Ingram going in the top of the draft, players who are clearly flawed but are being overdrafted because teams overvalue youth and perceived upside rather than basketball skill level.

LeBron, Kobe and Dirk came in the NBA before 20. This is a different league than in 1993. 

Even then, all of the upperclassmen studs who came out of college was drafted in the top 8. Wade wasn't drafted at 15. You gotta have high quality picks. It's damn near mandatory even if your philosophy is drafting upperclassmen like Curry or Wade.

 

I personally rather upperclassmen or at least two and done over college FR for several reasons but I would lying if I said I would not take one who was talented. I really do not like taking college seniors outside of the lottery. Most of them aren't that good and never become more than average. I rather take them in the 2nd round. 

Edited May 26, 2017 by NBASupes

[High5]

It's interesting that people refuse to believe we can find success after tanking or "semi-tanking," but it's perfectly reasonable to turn an old, cap-restricted team without a star player into contenders. The Warriors had to be bad to get Curry and Thompson. The Cavs had to be bad to get LeBron, Kyrie, and Love. The Spurs had to be bad to get Duncan. The Celtics had to be bad to get KG and Allen. The Heat had to be bad to get Wade. The Mavs had to be bad to get Dirk. None of these teams would have won a championship without falling down first. 

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, High5 said:

It's interesting that people refuse to believe we can find success after tanking or "semi-tanking," but it's perfectly reasonable to turn an old, cap-restricted team without a star player into contenders. The Warriors had to be bad to get Curry and Thompson. The Cavs had to be bad to get LeBron, Kyrie, and Love. The Spurs had to be bad to get Duncan. The Celtics had to be bad to get KG and Allen. The Heat had to be bad to get Wade. The Mavs had to be bad to get Dirk. None of these teams would have won a championship without falling down first. 

Or get lucky. Atlanta almost got lucky with Giannis. Since then, we haven't seen another case like him and might never see it again.

[NBASupes]

1-10 NFL 1st round

11-20 NFL 2nd round

21-30 NFL 3rd round

31-40 NFL 4th round 

41-50 NFL 5th round

51-60 NFL 6th round

There is no NBA comparison for the 7th round.

@KB21, when you think about it like this, you will realize why losing is important. 

Sure, you could find Russell Wilson in the 3rd round but how many team's have QBs starting outside of the 1st round draft picks and now many are franchise players?

Edited May 26, 2017 by NBASupes

[High5]

15 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

1-10 NFL 1st round

11-20 NFL 2nd round

21-30 NFL 3rd round

31-40 NFL 4th round 

41-50 NFL 5th round

51-60 NFL 6th round

There is no NBA comparison for the 7th round.

@KB21, when you think about it like this, you will realize why losing is important. 

Sure, you could find Russell Wilson in the 3rd round but how many team's have QBs starting outside of the 1st round draft picks and now many are franchise players?

I'm with you on the basketball stuff (this time), but Brady, Rodgers*, Wilson, and Brees have all won championships recently. That's not a great argument. 

*my bad, thought Rodgers was a 2nd round pick. Still, he was a late first. 

 

Edited May 26, 2017 by High5