GM says Dwight Howard has a place on this team

[Plainview1981]

14 hours ago, Flight said:

Apparently dominating the glass isn't a skill.... noted. 

And first of all no one is happy to lose on any team, but at the same time we would need to make significant roster changes to really decline next year. 

But if we're gonna ignore everything that goes into the season that effects the team than we could also say Paul Millsap's first year with us replacing Smoove was a failure (since we went 38-44) right? 

I dont have have unrealistic expectations for Dwight so I'm not gonna turn into a pessimist over night . He's a center, and for center isn't a position that typically produces the most skilled player in the lineup. All I need him to do is continue to be the best rebounding center we've had in over two decades. I'm actually excited to see what he can do with Bud putting more focus on coaching. 

Yes, we know he rebounds.... Problem is... He doesn't do much of anything else.

This team was worse than its record suggests. They suffered numerous blow out losses this year. This team has declined for 2 straight years and there isn't much reason to think that will not continue this year.

I was lukewarm on Dwight when the Hawks signed him. Some folks bought into the idea that his decline on offense was because Kobe and Harden were just ball hogs that wouldn't give him the ball, but he ends up with about the same shot attempts here. Stat wise, his numbers aren't that far off what I expected. Some people here were thinking that he would go back up to 16-19 PPG, but that was never going to happen.

I wasn't all that critical of Dwight for most of the season.  But the later it got into the season and throughout the playoffs it just became clear to me that he really isn't a good fit. He doesn't do many of the little things, and he doesn't provide much leadership either. I know you say that his complaining after the playoffs was just him wanting to win. I think its more than that. He isn't going to come out at the end of his first year and say that he wants to be traded. I believe his complains are just a small glimpse of an issue that will get worse during his tenure as a Hawk.

He isn't going to go all out Barkley and Shaq and just rant to the media. He will start out with some seemingly small complaints, but he will likely become a problem child behind the scenes. There is a reason that so few are sad to see him go when he leaves. It's likely that the majority of his unhappiness will be seen by those people behind the scenes. It didn't take along for a rift between Dwight and Dennis to happen... Just like it seemed to happen with Kobe/Dwight and Harden/Dwight. It's going to be the same old crap.

 

 

 

Edited June 18, 2017 by Hotlanta1981

[Vol4ever]

On 6/17/2017 at 0:09 PM, Hotlanta1981 said:

Almost nobody outside of some people on this forum really believe in Dwight at this point. There is a reason for that.

 It's simply not going to end well for the Dwight defenders.

He doesn't make teams better and he isn't worth half of the money he gets now.

Problem wasnt Dwight, it was coaching and losing Teague.  Dennis was up and down.  Bud did not adapt to his personnel and he had no consistent shooters.  

[Lurker]

This thread is back? I'd say Schlenk is posturing and again, I ask the Dwight-stans, how many more teams does Dwight need to get ran off of before y'all all suck it up and admit, it's Dwight?

[Plainview1981]

It's always something other than Dwight. That's why other teams were tripping over each other in order to sign him.

Edited June 18, 2017 by Hotlanta1981

[GrimeyKidd]

Andddd badumtish this thread takes a close.

[Flight]

4 hours ago, Hotlanta1981 said:

It's always something other than Dwight. That's why other teams were tripping over each other in order to sign him.

 

I highly doubt you have any idea what any teams were doing in reference to him. You're assuming no one was after him to continue to undermine him, even though it's pretty obvious you're not going to like him regardless of what happens. I'm not sure what exactly you gain from your pessimism but if you're not giving him credit for anything he does well statistically then you could spare us all the opinionated based negativity. 

[CP61]

22 hours ago, Flight said:

Apparently dominating the glass isn't a skill.... noted. 

And first of all no one is happy to lose on any team, but at the same time we would need to make significant roster changes to really decline next year. 

But if we're gonna ignore everything that goes into the season that effects the team than we could also say Paul Millsap's first year with us replacing Smoove was a failure (since we went 38-44) right? 

I dont have have unrealistic expectations for Dwight so I'm not gonna turn into a pessimist over night . He's a center, and for center isn't a position that typically produces the most skilled player in the lineup. All I need him to do is continue to be the best rebounding center we've had in over two decades. I'm actually excited to see what he can do with Bud putting more focus on coaching. 

I'm pretty sure in the context here that skilled means dribbling, passing, and shooting. Not a physical talent like rebounding.

[Flight]

8 minutes ago, CP61 said:

I'm pretty sure in the context here that skilled means dribbling, passing, and shooting. Not a physical talent like rebounding.

My problem with that is that by that definition we're defining skilled by Guard & Forward favoring standards. Skills are the ability to do certain things at a high expertise style level. Rebounding isn't something that should be overlooked. Just because you're big doesn't mean you'll get rebounds.  Especially consistently in this league. Aside from that, shooting the best percentage of your career doesn't come without increased understanding of what's a good shot and what isn't. 

I don't expect 90% of centers to be great shooters, dribblers and passers. 

[CP61]

5 minutes ago, Flight said:

My problem with that is that by that definition we're defining skilled by Guard & Forward favoring standards. Skills are the ability to do certain things at a high expertise style level. Rebounding isn't something that should be overlooked. Just because you're big doesn't mean you'll get rebounds.  Especially consistently in this league. Aside from that, shooting the best percentage of your career doesn't come without increased understanding of what's a good shot and what isn't. 

I don't expect 90% of centers to be great shooters, dribblers and passers. 

Well those 10% of centers are the only ones that should be making Dwight's salary. Dwight is a fine player who is great at what he does. What he does doesn't fit in here or in the league in general much anymore. 

[Lurker]

I'm not doing this ish again but if Dennis was being selfish and failing to help guys that struggle to score, explain why Taurean was worlds better than he mainly was in the regular season. And don't say that he was putting on moves to help him, because for the most part, he sure as heck was not. He was being fed in transition and space was being made for him to straight line drive to the hoop. We continue to ignore that Taurean struggled to finish at the rim when he saw more than two people at it. Was he ever given situations in which he saw two? Not really until game 5.

Just because someone failed to do anything, doesn't mean that someone was being selfish. If Dwight was dropping passes from me or fumbling the ball, I would be ignoring him too. There is absolutely nothing that says if Dwight was actually used as an offensive option, the Hawks would have won the series. Nothing. Nothing.

And even despite this, I'm not all in on Dennis. But the narrative on but but, Dwight is fine would be different if Teague were here. I'm almost 100% sure that everything barely changes if Teague is here. Maybe the Hawks win a couple they shouldn't have but it doesn't actually become a muh good team and Dwight is still uninvolved with him here. It's a 45 win team if he's here.

[Flight]

12 hours ago, CP61 said:

Well those 10% of centers are the only ones that should be making Dwight's salary. Dwight is a fine player who is great at what he does. What he does doesn't fit in here or in the league in general much anymore. 

Those 10% of Centers that are skilled are usually not good rebounders. Here's a list just to help you gauge the way centers are getting paid these days.

 http://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/cap-hit/center/

Dwight is contributing just as much as any other center in his pay range. No one is paying centers to be the lead passers, shooters and assist men on their team. That just isn't the job of a center in general and if you think that's what's not fitting the league anymore then you might as well get rid of all centers because the majority of them focus on getting rebounds and being a presence in the paint.

[CP61]

17 minutes ago, Flight said:

you might as well get rid of all centers

See you make a good point here. The Warriors have killed the position is the exact point I'm trying to make. What used to be a power forward is now a center. Look at the top rebounding teams and tell me there is a correlation between rebounding and team success. 

[Thomas]

Yes there is a correlation between them.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/team/_/stat/rebounds-per-game

[CP61]

1 minute ago, Thomas said:

Yes.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/team/_/stat/rebounds-per-game

THats the postseason. Obviously the teams in the postseason are all good

[Thomas]

1 minute ago, CP61 said:

THats the postseason. Obviously the teams in the postseason are all good

Your right, my bad.

[CP61]

2 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Your right, my bad.

In the regular season there are good teams in the bottom 5 and bad teams in the top 5. 

[Plainview1981]

14 hours ago, Flight said:

 

I highly doubt you have any idea what any teams were doing in reference to him. You're assuming no one was after him to continue to undermine him, even though it's pretty obvious you're not going to like him regardless of what happens. I'm not sure what exactly you gain from your pessimism but if you're not giving him credit for anything he does well statistically then you could spare us all the opinionated based negativity. 

If he had plenty of offers for the money the Hawks signed him for he probably wouldn't be here now. He didn't want to come here before...

If I was just out to hate him I would have been hating on him all year. But that wasn't the case. He delivered very little in the playoffs and started to complain about his role even though he didn't produce when he was in there. He only had one good game against Washington. He still expects big minutes and to be on the floor during crunch time even if he isn't producing. These are the things entitled players do.

We'll see where things stand at this time next year. I have a feeling he'll have less supporters instead of more of them.

[Plainview1981]

6 minutes ago, Hotlanta1981 said:

If he had plenty of offers for the money the Hawks signed him for he probably wouldn't be here now. He didn't want to come here before...

If I was just out to hate him I would have been hating on him all year. But that wasn't the case. He delivered very little in the playoffs and started to complain about his role even though he didn't produce when he was in there. He only had one good game against Washington. He still expects big minutes and to be on the floor during crunch time even if he isn't producing. These are the things entitled players do.

We'll see where things stand at this time next year. I have a feeling he'll have less supporters instead of more of them.

Moreover, He is an aging and declining vet that still expects to be treated and used as if he is still the same player that he used to be. If you're the kind of person that can read between the lines you can see what is going on here. If you can't... Well, you'll just assume that he is complaining because he just wants to win and nothing else. However, I think Dwight is a selfish player that has done nothing but look out for himself. He takes no responsibility and that's why he has so many children and baby mama's.

[Plainview1981]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1526038-dwight-howards-complaining-is-another-unnecessary-distraction-for-la-lakers

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/241954/Dwight-Howard-Asked-Daryl-Morey-Why-Am-I-Here-When-Told-Of-Reduced-Role

Dwight Howard was asked to elaborate on why he felt "disinterested" during parts of his season with the Houston Rockets.

"There were times I was disinterested because of situations that happened behind the scenes that really hurt me," said Howard. "It left me thinking, 'This is not what I signed up for.'''

Howard was asked to specify what he was referring to.

"I felt like my role was being reduced. I went to [Rockets general manager] Daryl [Morey] and said, 'I want to be more involved.' Daryl said, 'No, we don't want you to be.' My response was, 'Why not? Why am I here?' It was shocking to me that it came from him instead of our coach. So I said to him, 'No disrespect to what you do, but you've never played the game. I've been in this game a long time. I know what it takes to be effective.'''

 

It's the same old thing starting up here.

[GrimeyKidd]

Can we drop it now? Schlenk said he has a role here. Gotta focus on draft since its 3 days away