Market set for THJ?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

16 minutes ago, DBac said:

I don't think he deserves an A+ but I think to this point Schlenk has done what he set out to do. We clearly wanted Dwight off the team and we really didn't want to re-commit to Millsap either. 

I think he can get to an A if he gets off some of these awful contracts and gets some good system fits so that the young talent on the team can be properly evaluated.

Selling off Dwight for scrubs and letting Millsap walk, was easy.   If he wants to impress me, get rid of Baze's contract and turn that into a "flexible asset".   If he can do that, he'll get props from me.

 

[marco102]

5 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

Spotrac is not even remotely as much of an authority on the Hawks cap compared to Hawksfanatic. He's not above making mistakes but I can probably count on 1 hand the number of mistakes he's had with regard to our cap situation. 

I wasn't saying he was wrong, but if you assume the Hawks will release the trade exceptions. I believe the Hawks still have plenty of flexibility.  I didn't read that entire article btw.  I probably will tomorrow at some point. 

[DBac]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Selling off Dwight for scrubs and letting Millsap walk, was easy.   If he wants to impress me, get rid of Baze's contract and turn that into a "flexible asset".   If he can do that, he'll get props from me.

 

I didn't say he did a tough job, I said that thus far he has done what he wanted to do. Like I think Cleveland has had a pretty poor offseason, their goal should've been to make themselves a bigger threat to Golden State and they haven't done a thing. On top of that they blew up their front office for no reason. That team's a ticking time bomb with Lebron's free agency coming up.

The second part of my post is what he would have to do to have an impressive (A) offseason. And it's not easy at all. I alluded to getting rid of Baze etc. (re: flexibility) and also getting guys that allow us to run our system properly (eg. not Dwight)

10 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

It's not too late to get it up to a B+ but between the ugly situations with how Dwight and Millsap were handled, whether true or not, created negative press for the Hawks and that sort of stuff isn't quickly forgotten around the league. 

Then because of the Millsap trade, we have to renounce ALL of our trade exceptions, renounce our mid-level and bi-annual exceptions, renounce the rights to Illy OR Humphries and Sefolosha. We can also not sign Dorsey to a 3 year contract, so we'd only have his early bird rights. Apparently the only advantage to us losing ALL of that is that we can package Crawford with someone else on the roster right now. According to Hawksfanatic we don't know if the Hawks made the Dwight trade using our cap space or if we generated a trade exception with it. If we generated a trade exception then Plumlee and Belli are not eligible to be traded until August 20th, which means we're not combining either of them with Crawford to get a big time contract in return. 

Still think he deserves a high grade for this offseason? 

I think I remember reading that we were already looking at trade scenarios for Plumlee and/or Belineli so I don't think we created the trade exception. Could be wrong though. 

And yeah he has work to do to get to a great offseason.

 

[JTB]

52 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

That's waaaaaay too generous. He's made a lot of mistakes this offseason. Even if he fields us a good bit of young talent the only thing he's done is lose Millsap and Howard while gaining a very late 1st round pick from the Rockets. 

Fair enough...I will give him a simple B if he can get THJ resigned. Howard was traded on purpose and sap we got a first rd pick...doesn't matter if the pick is late or not, the fact that we got something is better than nothing which is normally what happens to this franchise.

Jamal Crawford is wanted by plenty of teams and he will be traded for either cap space, a draft pick, or a young prospect.

the only down fall I see is that Schlenk is sitting on his hands with some free agents that could be on the roster right now.

[Admin]

8 minutes ago, JTB said:

Fair enough...I will give him a simple B if he can get THJ resigned. Howard was traded on purpose and sap we got a first rd pick...doesn't matter if the pick is late or not, the fact that we got something is better than nothing which is normally what happens to this franchise.

Jamal Crawford is wanted by plenty of teams and he will be traded for either cap space, a draft pick, or a young prospect.

the only down fall I see is that Schlenk is sitting on his hands with some free agents that could be on the roster right now.

If HF is correct then we don't have the money to sign any FA's right now.  Until we do all of the renouncing we don't even have enough room to officially acquire Crawford. Then once we do have him, we have to find a team who has an expiring contract that's within range of Crawford's and whom we would want plus that team would have to want to give him up for Crawford. That seems highly unlikely to me. The way I see it, Schlenk is gearing up to try and make a big trade to give a team major cap relief by us moving Crawford and Plumlee to them together OR he's planning on keeping Crawford and outside of minimum contracts that will pretty much be it for us this offseason. 

23 minutes ago, marco102 said:

I wasn't saying he was wrong, but if you assume the Hawks will release the trade exceptions. I believe the Hawks still have plenty of flexibility.  I didn't read that entire article btw.  I probably will tomorrow at some point. 

It won't make you happy to read it that's for sure. I certainly thought we were in much better shape than we are. 

[JTB]

15 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

If HF is correct then we don't have the money to sign any FA's right now.  Until we do all of the renouncing we don't even have enough room to officially acquire Crawford. Then once we do have him, we have to find a team who has an expiring contract that's within range of Crawford's and whom we would want plus that team would have to want to give him up for Crawford. That seems highly unlikely to me. The way I see it, Schlenk is gearing up to try and make a big trade to give a team major cap relief by us moving Crawford and Plumlee to them together OR he's planning on keeping Crawford and outside of minimum contracts that will pretty much be it for us this offseason. 

 

Interesting 

[parfait]

1 hour ago, Dolfan23 said:

Oh and even though he won't play for us this year, we get to pay Dunleavy 1.7 million because we didn't get rid of him in time. 

Actually he would have cost us over $5 million if we didn't get rid of him in time. He was going to cost us $1.7 million no matter what. And unlike past years, nobody was interested in trading for partially guaranteed contracts (remember the summer of 2014 when Danny Ferry gave up Lucas Noguiera and Lou Williams for John Salmons and his $7 million contract that had a $1 million buyout). Well every team that had such a contract this summer had to just cut them, just like the Hawks did, as there was no longer a market for them.

[thecampster]

3 hours ago, DBac said:

I don't think he deserves an A+ but I think to this point Schlenk has done what he set out to do. We clearly wanted Dwight off the team and we really didn't want to re-commit to Millsap either. 

I think he can get to an A if he gets off some of these awful contracts and gets some good system fits so that the young talent on the team can be properly evaluated.

Kevin Costner negotiating with Schlenk.  (I'll give you 3 2nd rounders for your 1st rounder this year and you know 3x2=6 and 6 > 1).

 

Edited July 6, 2017 by thecampster

[BrazilianHawk]

9 hours ago, thecampster said:

Agreed....Timmy improved both offensively and defensively the last 2 years and it would be a shame to let him get away. He is a worker and there isn't enough of that in the NBA these days.

There's a whole lot of players that give their all on the court, actually.

Just the other day the Nuggets managed to get one of those on a great contract... Easily.

I say let Junior go.

[BrazilianHawk]

7 hours ago, Dolfan23 said:

It's not too late to get it up to a B+ but between the ugly situations with how Dwight and Millsap were handled, whether true or not, created negative press for the Hawks and that sort of stuff isn't quickly forgotten around the league. 

Then because of the Millsap trade, we have to renounce ALL of our trade exceptions, renounce our mid-level and bi-annual exceptions, renounce the rights to Illy OR Humphries and Sefolosha. We can also not sign Dorsey to a 3 year contract, so we'd only have his early bird rights. Apparently the only advantage to us losing ALL of that is that we can package Crawford with someone else on the roster right now. According to Hawksfanatic we don't know if the Hawks made the Dwight trade using our cap space or if we generated a trade exception with it. If we generated a trade exception then Plumlee and Belli are not eligible to be traded until August 20th, which means we're not combining either of them with Crawford to get a big time contract in return. 

Still think he deserves a high grade for this offseason? 

That's an F to me.

[AHF]

9 hours ago, Dolfan23 said:

Oh and even though he won't play for us this year, we get to pay Dunleavy 1.7 million because we didn't get rid of him in time. 

By get rid of him do you mean get someone to trade for him?  I can't imagine anyone wanting him.  We got rid of him in time to avoid owing him another $3M.  There was never any avoiding the $1.7M unless we traded him.

[swanlee]

We need to do whatever it takes to keep him. You gotta keep guys entering their prime that have already delivered. It's one thing to not pay guys over 30 to much but at 25 and hitting it big here as a team you have to keep those types of guys.

[Admin]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

By get rid of him do you mean get someone to trade for him?  I can't imagine anyone wanting him.  We got rid of him in time to avoid owing him another $3M.  There was never any avoiding the $1.7M unless we traded him.

That's what I'm referring to. He should have been part of the Dwight trade even if it needed to be expanded a bit. 

[Admin]

1 hour ago, swanlee said:

We need to do whatever it takes to keep him. You gotta keep guys entering their prime that have already delivered. It's one thing to not pay guys over 30 to much but at 25 and hitting it big here as a team you have to keep those types of guys.

Conversely do you keep a guy who did his best for you in a contact year and who also wilted badly in the playoffs? I'm all for keeping him but if he's asking for more than 10-12 then good luck to ya. 

[AHF]

21 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

That's what I'm referring to. He should have been part of the Dwight trade even if it needed to be expanded a bit. 

That Dwight trade seems to have not been a maximum value proposition to me.  The Dunleavy part of it doesn't bother me as much as the Plumlee part.

[sturt]

11 hours ago, DBac said:

Still think he deserves a high grade for this offseason?

Answer: I don't know if he will or won't earn a high grade, but I'm disinterested in passing judgment on the student before we even get to mid-terms. But honestly, I never thought there'd be a taker for Dwight's contract. And I think 90% of those who now say "oh that was no big deal," if ingested with sodium pentothal, would admit they thought like me a month ago.

[thecampster]

12 hours ago, Dolfan23 said:

It's not too late to get it up to a B+ but between the ugly situations with how Dwight and Millsap were handled, whether true or not, created negative press for the Hawks and that sort of stuff isn't quickly forgotten around the league. 

Then because of the Millsap trade, we have to renounce ALL of our trade exceptions, renounce our mid-level and bi-annual exceptions, renounce the rights to Illy OR Humphries and Sefolosha. We can also not sign Dorsey to a 3 year contract, so we'd only have his early bird rights. Apparently the only advantage to us losing ALL of that is that we can package Crawford with someone else on the roster right now. According to Hawksfanatic we don't know if the Hawks made the Dwight trade using our cap space or if we generated a trade exception with it. If we generated a trade exception then Plumlee and Belli are not eligible to be traded until August 20th, which means we're not combining either of them with Crawford to get a big time contract in return. 

Still think he deserves a high grade for this offseason? 

The trade was made before July 1, which means we were operating in 2016/2017 numbers.  Those cap numbers shown on major sites do not take into account the actual amount of salary spent by the team because trades/signing throughout the year begin/end their salary accumulation against the cap at that time.  The Hawks were over the cap last year when you account for the carried over cap holds (that are still there) from the previous exceptions. There is no mystery to how it was done, an exception would have been created. Typically whether or not teams renounce exceptions is not made for public consumption for some time. If they were, you'd be scratching your head over most of the deals that get done with teams "under" the cap. They only got there because of those renounced exceptions.

Edited July 6, 2017 by thecampster