The Superteams effect on the Hawks.

[Diesel]

5 hours ago, marco102 said:

You're talking about two different things here and you know you need to concede on one.  If you're talking about contracts given out in 2016 when the market was so inflated that Bazemore got a $70 million deal then yes, THjr is more than reasonable.   But if you are talking about contracts giving out in 2017, which is what @AHF, and everyone except you  are talking about.  You KNOW THjr's contract is inflated because no one got anything close to that in terms of average salary and longevity in the 2017 market. You're a very intelligent person so you know you're arguing just for the sake of arguing.  Can we agree that his contract is bloated compared to the contracts given out in 2017 only. Don't go pulling up shooting guards who got over paid when the salary cap jumped $20,000,000 so every team had to spend to meet the minimum floor.

No.  I'm talking about cause/effect and evaluation. 

When you evaluate the young player THJr... where does he fall?  AHF said close to Waiters.  Well Waiters is ranked #20 amoung SGs (By Salary) which to me seems not to fit his production and potential.  Otherwise, I could agree with AHF.  Off the top, if I were ranking the SGs by production and potential, I would say it looks like this:

 

1.   Harden, 
2.  Butler, 
3.  Derozen
4. Thompson
5. Beal
6. Wade
7. McColloum
8. Booker
9. Wiggins
10. Batum
11. Hardaway Jr. 
12. Waiters
13. Fournier
14. Oladipo.
15. Reddick
16. Gordon
17. Lou Williams
18. Harris
19. Curry
20. Caldwell Pope. 

 

Now, the area where those guys appear is not an area in today's game where you will pay 11 Million.   Sorry.   So what I'm saying is that when you honestly rank production and potential, Hardaway Jr is right outside of the top 10 and top 10 money right now is just about where he's being paid. 

 

[AHF]

Had to cap this one off with the inevitable quote from one more person in the NBA who thinks the Knicks offer to THJr was crazy.

Timmy himself.

Quote

Tim Hardaway Jr.’s first words after signing that contract: “Man, that’s crazy.”

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/07/27/tim-hardaway-jr-s-reported-reaction-to-knicks-71-million-offer-man-thats-crazy/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs&yptr=yahoo

[Diesel]

7 minutes ago, AHF said:

Had to cap this one off with the inevitable quote from one more person in the NBA who thinks the Knicks offer to THJr was crazy.

Timmy himself.

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/07/27/tim-hardaway-jr-s-reported-reaction-to-knicks-71-million-offer-man-thats-crazy/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs&yptr=yahoo

Context is everything. 

His whole quote talked about it was crazy that the team that traded him away was the team that gave him the offer 2 years letter. 

Quote

“You play here for two years and then you’re gone,” Hardaway said Monday afternoon at a Knicks’ basketball camp. “Then two years later you get a phone call and it’s like, ‘Wow!’ I wouldn’t expect it coming from them. I would expect from a different team or a different franchise. When I got the call I was very, very happy and overwhelmed.”

 

[AHF]

Different quote entirely.

 

Funny stuff here.

http://thespun.com/nba/new-york-knicks/new-york-knicks-offer-tim-hardaway-jr-atlanta-hawks

[TheNorthCydeRises]

If the Hawks didn't grossly overpay for Bazemore the year before, we would've matched the Hardaway Jr offer.   Had THJ played much better during the playoffs, we more than likely match the offer, even with Baze on the team.

Diesel is right in that 15 - 17 million is the market value for a top 15 SG in this league.  Question is if THJ is a top 15 SG?  Some of the guys making less than THJ are better than him.   Lou Williams and Eric Gordon are better.  Some of the guys still on their rookie deals, like Zach Lavine, Devin Booker, and Gary Harris are better.

I personally think that a guy like Dion Waiters was underpaid, for what he contributed to that Heat team.  Most of us had Timmy pegged as a 15 mill a year player, before the playoffs.   The Knicks DID overpay, but if THJ plays like he did in the 2nd half of the season, the money will have been worth it for the Knicks.