An interesting Statistical view of Dennis.

[Lurker]

Now here's a guarantee...

No matter what, if Dennis still makes too many of those Josh Smith plays 3 years from now, you can bump this thread and I'll mow down a healthy helping of crow (along with a bunch of other people). But I suspect it will turn out, that this thread was absolutely ridiculous and unnecessary.

[kurupt]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

While you are still being insulting... Do you know the difference between a PNR play and a Post up Play??  It seems like you obviously Don't.  Because while we were talking about PNRs... you polluted the board with some mess about Howard and Post up plays...  So let me help you:

 

https://www.peachtreehoops.com/2017/1/11/14235784/breaking-down-the-paul-millsap-dwight-howard-pick-and-roll

 

Check out the PNR here.  It's Millsap to Dwight.  Dwight sets the pick.. then he rolls to the basket.  We call that a 5-4 PNR.  IF the pick is set well, Sap could go on to the basket himself.   However, if Dwight's man stay with Sap, then Dwight rolls to the basket and gets an open alley opp.   Check it out...so that you won't be ignorant about this matter. 

Here's another one with Baze...

This is Calderon on the PNR finding Howard on the drive.  Very Stockton like. 

Speaking of Calderon... here's how he was received:

It's a shame that we let him slip away this off-season.  I think he made a much better BU PG than Delaney. 

Are you GRAVELY MISTAKEN? I am seriously asking. Because it seems like you either cannot read of have a serious mental issue that prevents you from grasping the most simple sentences.

This is what I wrote. I EVEN f***ing INCREASED THE FONT SIZE FOR YOUR DUMB ASS! And I am gonna do it again;

Quote

Now let’s look at him as a Pick&Roll player as the rolling man. Among 107 players that have more than 1 possession of this kind [per game] and have played more than 20 games, Howard has the 9^th lowest frequency as the roll man with 10.1%. Paul Millsap, for example, is at 23.4% (33^rd). Dwight Howard scores 1.18 PPP on these plays, which is 15^th among qualified players (Millsap has a paltry 0.86 PPP). Howards FG% of 66% is the 7^th best and his TO% 40% lower than on post-ups.

 

There is no way the Hawks should involve Howard in more post-plays. He already is used a ton compared to all other players and he is not very efficient at it.  He should be involved more often as the roll-man in P&R plays. But as Budenholzer already publicly said: he has to come out and set screens in the first place (and decent ones) to do that. His scoring would skyrocket. But Dwight doesn’t want that.

Dwight Howard refused to play P&R more frequently despite it working well. It got so bad that Budenholzer in the playoffs said that he won't get more touches/playing time unless he starts setting more screens.

And please, stop telling me about Schröders experience in Germany. Just stop making up your BOVINE FERTILIZING PRODUCT.

[Diesel]

Kurupt... I was looking for your source... and then I realized that you have no source listed.   But if you want to talk about PNR... Dwight Howard.. I have a credible source for you.

According to NBA.com

Dwight Howard has a 63.3% scoring frequency as the roll man on the PNR play. 

That's better than Greg Monroe, Tristan Thompson, Hasan Whiteside, Enes Kanter, Karl Anthony Townes, Gortat, Drummond, Adams, Jokic, Davis,  and Dieng.

Now.. whatever Statistic that you're quoting.. you can have that.   I will trust the NBA.com.  

[kurupt]

You are MISGUIDED. I don't post my sources again and again and again, because you just ignore everything anyway.

http://stats.nba.com/players/roll-man/

http://stats.nba.com/players/post-up/

http://stats.nba.com/players/post-touch/

http://stats.nba.com/players/paint-touch/

And to your point: Exactly MY POINT, you UNDERINFORMED FELLOW SQUAWKER. Howard was super efficient as the roll-man...but HE DID NOT PLAY P&R often. In fact, he was amongst the players with the lowest frequency of this play, because he still wants to be a Low-Post scorer (which he is bad at) rather than play to his strength.

That's what I have pointed out to you about 5 times now. Learn the f***ing difference between number/frequency of plays and efficiency.

[rd79]

6 hours ago, AHF said:

KNOCK OFF THE NAME CALLING ON THIS THREAD.  

 

DONT LIKE ISSUING WARNINGS BUT THAT IS THE NEXT STEP -- ADDRESS THE ISSUE NOT THE POSTER.

But unfortunately sometimes the poster is the issue... I know it's not tolerated here to call out s, but this doesn't mean they don't exist

[Peoriabird]

6 hours ago, AHF said:

KNOCK OFF THE NAME CALLING ON THIS THREAD.  

 

DONT LIKE ISSUING WARNINGS BUT THAT IS THE NEXT STEP -- ADDRESS THE ISSUE NOT THE POSTER.

Even you have to admit that Diesel is ing hard so you may have to make some exception in this case.  I know there shouldn't be name calling but Diesel is being ridiculous.  Please don't ban anyone  yet especially Kurupt because he is making some very good points that are being lost because someone has become a  ever since Millsap left.

[AHF]

9 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Even you have to admit that Diesel is trolling hard so you may have to make some exception in this case.  I know there shouldn't be name calling but Diesel is being ridiculous.  Please don't ban anyone  yet especially Kurupt because he is making some very good points that are being lost because someone has become a  ever since Millsap left.

You've got three options if you think someone is trolling:

#1 - Ignore them.

#2 - Rebut their argument.

#3 - Report them to the moderators.

Don't resort to name calling, questioning their fandom, questioning their intelligence, etc.

[Peoriabird]

17 minutes ago, AHF said:

You've got three options if you think someone is trolling:

#1 - Ignore them.

#2 - Rebut their argument.

#3 - Report them to the moderators.

Don't resort to name calling, questioning their fandom, questioning their intelligence, etc.

This constant unnecessary ranting against our players and GM is destroying this site.  Personally I think it is more damaging than the occasional deserved insult. This is suppose to a site where fans of the team can talk with other fans having more knowledge and understanding of the Hawk's players. Instead you get someone starting a million threads trying to turn people against this team and GM by presenting false information while ignoring real information. If anyone need to be warned, it should be the s not the fans the passionately support and believe in the team and it's players.

[lethalweapon3]

3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

This constant unnecessary ranting against our players and GM is destroying this site.  Personally I think it is more damaging than the occasional deserved insult. This is suppose to a site where fans of the team can talk with other fans having more knowledge and understanding of the Hawk's players. Instead you get someone starting a million threads trying to turn people against this team and GM by presenting false information while ignoring real information. If anyone need to be warned, it should be the s not the fans the passionately support and believe in the team and it's players.

Often our "knowledge and understanding" of players and staff is of the critical variety, and that's fine! Let our more skeptical fans be themselves w/o (Dolfan rule judiciously applied above) calling them s and such.

You can always help build, rather than destroy, a site by contributing (more of) your own content. Whether it's more substantive than the discussion points you dislike or not, it can only add to the discussion and not detract from it.

~lw3

[kurupt]

Respect is a two-way street - and it is usually earned. If I put in the work (sometimes 15-20 minutes of research) to make a detailed post about something and someone either

1. ignores and/or
2. misinterprets and/or
3. moves the goalposts

regarding these posts every single time on purpose and without putting any research/effort into his own argument, that is disrespectful towards me and I will call that behaviour out.

I would post a lot more here, heck, I had a very detailed player-by-player review of the season and the outlook for the next one already written, but I decided against it because every thread gets derailed by Diesel anyway and he doesn't give a flying f*** about. Half of the threads on page 1 are by him, basically all with meaningless one-liner-like premises and without any substantial discussion at all.

I have zero problem with different opinions as long as they are reasonable and at least somewhat well argued. Spouting the same thing over and over and over again (Schröder doesn't pass the ball and plays only ISO, Howards doesn't get enough post touches, for example), even when several posters rebutt it with simple facts, is really bad for any argument.

I don't even have a problem with Hotlantas negativity - at least it is not repeated 10x in every single thread. But having people like "campster" posting "He is a loser." about any player is completely unnecessary and f***ing stupid. Period.

Edited August 1, 2017 by kurupt

[lethalweapon3]

If we could lay out the number of posters who got Bizanned just by over-reacting to posters who feast off over-reaction (in August!), we'd be rivaling Oakland Cemetery out here. Agree to disagree, or avoid the urge to engage and move on to other things.

"The Trick is Not Minding"

~lawrenceofarabia3

[lethalweapon3]

And this thread gets locked if the next six-letter D being discussed isn't Dennis.

~lw3

[hazer]

 

We can discuss geometry, right? Come ooooon now, that's funny.....

[AHF]

1 hour ago, lethalweapon3 said:

If we could lay out the number of posters who got Bizanned just by over-reacting to posters who feast off over-reaction (in August!), we'd be rivaling Oakland Cemetery out here. Agree to disagree, or avoid the urge to engage and move on to other things.

"The Trick is Not Minding"

~lawrenceofarabia3

I'll also point out that people can put a poster on "ignore" if they think he is dragging down their experience with the site.  Then you won't even see those posts.

If the poster is dragging threads off topic, PM a moderator and we'll either shut it down or separate it from the thread if it is too distracting.  In the summer, there tends to be a lot of repetition since we have no new data and little changing after the major free agent rush which can aggravate people as lw3 noted above but keep bringing the new content and chatting with fellow bball fans.

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, kurupt said:

And to your point: Exactly MY POINT, you UNDERINFORMED FELLOW SQUAWKER. Howard was super efficient as the roll-man...but HE DID NOT PLAY P&R often. In fact, he was amongst the players with the lowest frequency of this play, because he still wants to be a Low-Post scorer (which he is bad at) rather than play to his strength.

That's what I have pointed out to you about 5 times now. Learn the f***ing difference between number/frequency of plays and efficiency.

I will take that you AGREE with me that he was effective in the pick and roll.   I agree with you that he didn't play Pick and Roll often.  Back to the point, Dennis initiates the offense... right?  I mean, how many times did Dennis play PNR with Dwight??  Seems to me like Somebody wanted dwight to play the pick and roll like Al Horford.  Thus at the end of the season, we have Dwight talking about working on his three point shoot and when finally traded, saying he can get back to playing the way he's used to.  Now when you read the article on Dwight's plays with Atlanta...missing  are these conversations about post ups.  I would think tht having a guy that's top 10 in PNR would lead to more PNRs... but unfortunately, I am not the pG.

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, kurupt said:

Respect is a two-way street - and it is usually earned. If I put in the work (sometimes 15-20 minutes of research) to make a detailed post about something and someone either

1. ignores and/or
2. misinterprets and/or
3. moves the goalposts

regarding these posts every single time on purpose and without putting any research/effort into his own argument, that is disrespectful towards me and I will call that behaviour out.

I would post a lot more here, heck, I had a very detailed player-by-player review of the season and the outlook for the next one already written, but I decided against it because every thread gets derailed by Diesel anyway and he doesn't give a flying f*** about. Half of the threads on page 1 are by him, basically all with meaningless one-liner-like premises and without any substantial discussion at all.

I have zero problem with different opinions as long as they are reasonable and at least somewhat well argued. Spouting the same thing over and over and over again (Schröder doesn't pass the ball and plays only ISO, Howards doesn't get enough post touches, for example), even when several posters rebutt it with simple facts, is really bad for any argument.

I don't even have a problem with Hotlantas negativity - at least it is not repeated 10x in every single thread. But having people like "campster" posting "He is a loser." about any player is completely unnecessary and f***ing stupid. Period.

YOu are one to talk about respect.  I try to have a conversation with you about Basketball... Like a man.. and you offer nothing but insult after insult.  You say that I drag the site down because I talk about your sacred cow.. do you think people want to read your curses and insults because you don't know how to have a conversation.  The high road is not high enough Kurupt.  I treat you with respect and what do you do in turn...  Loser, Stupid, Dumb.. this is what people ought to expect from you if they have a different point of view than you... Moreover, the original article that brings up this statistical view about Dennis is not from ME.. so deal with that.

[lethalweapon3]

~lw3