The Tank Thread

[KB21]

3 minutes ago, hazer said:

Yes, there is. There are several ways to tank (as I listed), and what Atlanta is doing lands somewhere in the middle of those extremes. When Hawks tanked last year, they didn't even try to be competitive. Now they've stacked the roster with youth and developmental players this year and are avoiding bringing on legitimate veteran talent, this year. They'll use cap space to take on bad contracts who are attached to "future assets" instead of using cap space to sign or trade for players that can help you get better now, this year. Thanks, we're all well aware of what tanking is. Some of us are also aware there are several different degrees of it.

Obviously, you aren't aware of what tanking is.

Tanking is the most deplorable thing in sports right now.  As a GM, you have a moral obligation to put forth your best effort to field a competitive team, and the GMs of teams that tank do not put forth this effort.  Their effort completely resolves around trying to lose.  That is what you are seeing Travis Schlenk do, and that is what Sam Hinkie did in Philadelphia, and both of them can go pound sand and skip rocks for all I care.  They shouldn't be in the NBA if this is the direction they want to go in.  They are not fulfilling their duty as a GM, and the fact that they both support tanking tells me that they are both morally corrupt individuals.  

[hazer]

15 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Obviously, you aren't aware of what tanking is.

Tanking is the most deplorable thing in sports right now.  As a GM, you have a moral obligation to put forth your best effort to field a competitive team, and the GMs of teams that tank do not put forth this effort.  Their effort completely resolves around trying to lose.  That is what you are seeing Travis Schlenk do, and that is what Sam Hinkie did in Philadelphia, and both of them can go pound sand and skip rocks for all I care.  They shouldn't be in the NBA if this is the direction they want to go in.  They are not fulfilling their duty as a GM, and the fact that they both support tanking tells me that they are both morally corrupt individuals.  

I'm very aware of what tanking is. As such, I've specifically listed several different nuanced levels of tanking and time frames actually showing a deeper understanding and grasp of tanking than your narrow take. As a GM, you have a moral obligation to put forth your best effort to bring a championship to your city, and the GMs of teams that do not put forth this effort by having their team treadmill in the 1st/2nd rounds for a decade shouldn't be in the NBA. There is shortsightedness, and then there's the long view. And some can't see the forest for he trees.

[hazer]

28 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Obviously, you aren't aware of what tanking is.

Tanking is the most deplorable thing in sports right now.  As a GM, you have a moral obligation to put forth your best effort to field a competitive team, and the GMs of teams that tank do not put forth this effort.  Their effort completely resolves around trying to lose.  That is what you are seeing Travis Schlenk do, and that is what Sam Hinkie did in Philadelphia, and both of them can go pound sand and skip rocks for all I care.  They shouldn't be in the NBA if this is the direction they want to go in.  They are not fulfilling their duty as a GM, and the fact that they both support tanking tells me that they are both morally corrupt individuals.  

[KB21]

2 minutes ago, hazer said:

I'm very aware of what tanking is. As such, I've specifically listed several different nuanced levels of tanking and time frames actually showing a deeper understanding and grasp of tanking than your narrow take. As a GM, you have a moral obligation to put forth your best effort to bring a championship to your city, and the GMs of teams that do not put forth this effort by having their team treadmill in the 1st/2nd rounds for a decade shouldn't be in the NBA. There is shortsightedness, and then there's the long view. And some can't see the forest for he trees.

Considering that no team that has ever tanked, a true tank, has won a championship, it is a stretch to say that unless your are tanking, you are not trying to bring a championship to your city.  In fact, based on the fact that tanking does not produce championships, it should be considered the other way around.

Maybe it will sink in this year when this team wins fewer games than it did last year because there will be even less veteran leadership on this team and more youth.  

Limited veteran leadership plus major minutes to young players = losing, and a worse overall record this year than last.  See the 76ers as an example.  They won 19 then 18 then 10 over the first three years of their tank.  That's what will happen in Atlanta.  24 in year 1.  Likely around 18 in year two.  Maybe back up to 22 or 23 wins in year 3 if they have actually hit on anyone in the last two drafts.  Year 4 will probably produce around 28-29 wins.  Year 5, they might get to 32 wins.  

[hazer]

1 minute ago, KB21 said:

Considering that no team that has ever tanked, a true tank, has won a championship, it is a stretch to say that unless your are tanking, you are not trying to bring a championship to your city.  In fact, based on the fact that tanking does not produce championships, it should be considered the other way around.

Maybe it will sink in this year when this team wins fewer games than it did last year because there will be even less veteran leadership on this team and more youth.  

Limited veteran leadership plus major minutes to young players = losing, and a worse overall record this year than last.  See the 76ers as an example.  They won 19 then 18 then 10 over the first three years of their tank.  That's what will happen in Atlanta.  24 in year 1.  Likely around 18 in year two.  Maybe back up to 22 or 23 wins in year 3 if they have actually hit on anyone in the last two drafts.  Year 4 will probably produce around 28-29 wins.  Year 5, they might get to 32 wins.  

We've all been round and round about the 1st paragraph for months and months and months, already covered that territory and not going there again.

We shall see about the rest, our official wager stands and I already have your avatar picked out

[AHF]

31 minutes ago, hazer said:

We've all been round and round about the 1st paragraph for months and months and months, already covered that territory and not going there again.

We shall see about the rest, our official wager stands and I already have your avatar picked out

On the definition of tanking, it not worth doing more than articulating your position in a post or two:

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

 That's what will happen in Atlanta.  24 in year 1.  Likely around 18 in year two. 

I need to make a bet with someone to make the bet thread...Can I bet you that the Hawks win over 20 games next season?

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

On the definition of tanking, it not worth doing more than articulating your position in a post or two:

[Wurider05]

Just wondering where we are technically speaking.  Did it start last year or does it start this year?

[JayBirdHawk]

I've said last year was the tear down. This is the 1st year of the rebuild - 1st top lottery pick of our own to start the rebuild.

[DS17Fanboy]

vor 2 Stunden, Wurider05 sagte:

Just wondering where we are technically speaking.  Did it start last year or does it start this year?

they already hedged their bets aquiring the prince pick.  the season after whas already a rebuild via sucking and failed building up of tradeable assets.

[NBASupes]

The summer of year 2

[Vol4ever]

5 more years and we will be in the same spot we were the last 10 years unless we grow a superstar or one walks into town.  

[BrazilianHawk]

3 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

5 more years and we will be in the same spot we were the last 10 years unless we grow a superstar or one walks into town.  

And then they'll hire some idiotic first-time GM who "has been on GSW for many years, so he has to be good, right?"

And then we'll wonder whether that would be the first or the second year again.

 

[DrReality]

My advice is don’t keep track of the time. Just make it worse.  

[Buzzard]

This is year two, but year two does not end until the end of this season.

They hired Travis May 2017: May 2018 was one full year with him at the helm.

I don't want to call a playoff season a rebuild; and Bud did everything in his power to keep us in playoff mediocrity by paying all that money out to Howard, Bazemore, and Dennis; and losing Horford was not done on purpose.

Trading Howard and letting Millsap walk was done on purpose. To me that signaled the start.

[Vol4ever]

We haven't had a GM since Ted Turner was the owner.  

[kg01]

23 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

5 more years and we will be in the same spot we were the last 10 years unless we grow a superstar or one walks into town.  

I actually agree with this.  However, I don't think 'where we were the last 10 years' was a desirable position either.

[KB21]

47 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I actually agree with this.  However, I don't think 'where we were the last 10 years' was a desirable position either.

Where we were the past 10 years is a hell of a lot better than where this team is now, unless the only thing you are excited about is getting high lottery picks and putting them into a situation of failure.

[kg01]

21 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Where we were the past 10 years is a hell of a lot better than where this team is now, unless the only thing you are excited about is getting high lottery picks and putting them into a situation of failure.

Not really.  In terms of winning a title, we're on the same island ... which is nowhere near winning a title.  At least now we have a chance at getting elite talent that we'll need.

And don't yell at me, I'm not as 'pro-tank' as most.  I just grew weary of watching us bump our heads on the glass ceiling.

We were basically that bumblebee trapped in a car but steadily flying headfirst into the inside of the windshield.  Admirable effort but the reality is that bumblebee's gonna end up dead and dried out at the base of the glass.