The Tank Thread

[buckyboy2]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Jared Sullinger?  Just saying you can't go by numbers alone

EXactly. I trust my eyes more than I trust numbers.....And I dont see IT with JJJ or Carter. 

Edited April 4, 2018 by buckyboy2

[Diesel]

4 hours ago, AHF said:

Diesel just said we should have done so and we should have paid the luxury tax for that lineup this week.

Nope.  No I didn't.  I said by not signing FAs, the owners saved Money.  Period.   End of statement.  Statement of fact.   I don't know why you continue to try to put more words in my mouth than what was said??

[Peoriabird]

Not to change the subject on you but I just noticed who KB21 wanted for the Hawks last year...He wanted us to trade up for this guy...Dude averaged .5 blocks per game with a Drtg 100.  Lauri Markkanen...Now he wants a defensive stalwart..LOL!  KB21 is a confusing lad!

[KB21]

Jared Sullinger was also a very good player until injuries killed his career.

[buckyboy2]

Just now, Diesel said:

Nope.  No I didn't.  I said by not signing FAs, the owners saved Money.  Period.   End of statement.  Statement of fact.   I don't know why you continue to try to put more words in my mouth than what was said??

Billionaires dont care about a few million $'s lol. THats like change you find in a couch for a normal person..

Just now, KB21 said:

Jared Sullinger was also a very good player until injuries killed his career.

Sullinger was NEVER a "very good" NBA player...

[Diesel]

4 hours ago, KB21 said:

Travis Schlenk isn't smart enough to do that.  He's already stated his desire to "build through the draft", and to be "young and fun".  

You might be right about that.   When Ainge traded for KG and then Allen, people thought he had thrown away Boston's future... and in a way he did because they only won one championship.   However, I doubt that most GMs would have pulled that trigger (Young star for vet).   I doubt this GM is willing to bypass his own pick for a shot at an aging vet seeing how he has traded aging vets for picks. 

 

[Peoriabird]

4 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Again, give me examples of poor college defenders like Bagley and Ayton that became good defenders in the NBA.

John Collins

[buckyboy2]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Not to change the subject on you but I just noticed who KB21 wanted for the Hawks last year...He wanted us to trade up for this guy...Dude averaged .5 blocks per game with a Drtg 100.  Lauri Markkanen...Now he wants a defensive stalwart..LOL!  KB21 is a confusing lad!

[KB21]

Just now, Peoriabird said:

Not to change the subject on you but I just noticed who KB21 wanted for the Hawks last year...He wanted us to trade up for this guy...Dude averaged .5 blocks per game with a Drtg 100.  Lauri Markkanen...Now he wants a defensive stalwart..LOL!  KB21 is a confusing lad!

I wanted Markkanen because of his elite shooting.

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

I see that is super unlikely.  He will improve given that he is only a rookie but with his scoring efficiency and per36 of 16 pt, 11 rb, 2 ast, 2 blk I see him getting more minutes in the future not less.  He can play and is already very productive in his time on the floor.  What else do you want in a rookie taken at #17?  He leads the Hawks in PER, WS, WS/48, VORP and BPM and by a large margin in every area.  Definite future starter in my eyes.

IF you were to go by Collins in college, he's going to be a good offensive guy but defensively he's going to be any team's Achilles 

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, Peoriabird said:

I would mind 2 Collins out there!  You seem to think its a negative!  LOL!

2 Collins and a Dennis??  High Scoring blowouts.  We're the Nuggets of the early 80s.

[Peoriabird]

2 minutes ago, KB21 said:

I wanted Markkanen because of his elite shooting.

Just saying that you are all over the place

[KB21]

7 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

John Collins

I said good defenders.  John is not currently a good defender.

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

2 Collins and a Dennis??  High Scoring blowouts.  We're the Nuggets of the early 80s.

Who has been blowing us out lately???  Have you watched any games??

[KB21]

Just now, Peoriabird said:

Just saying that you are all over the place

No, I'm not.  I look at players and evaluate whether I think they have elite skills.  Markkanen's shooting is an elite skill for a 7 footer.  

[AHF]

13 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Nope.  No I didn't.  I said by not signing FAs, the owners saved Money.  Period.   End of statement.  Statement of fact.   I don't know why you continue to try to put more words in my mouth than what was said??

Didn't mean to offend.  I thought you were arguing the team had not done things that should have been done in order to save money.  You might as well now be arguing that the team only didn't max Moose to save money.  Who cares what they didn't do if doing it was a bad idea in the first place?

Plus, you can understand my confusion that I thought you implied the team had not done something you thought they should have done:

 

On 6/5/2017 at 8:52 AM, Diesel said:

....

Resign Hardaway/Ersan.

....

THJr/Bazemore.

THJr is ready to be a star.  Baze becomes our defensive stopper/energy guy off the bench at the 2 and 3.

 

 

On 6/22/2017 at 9:07 AM, Diesel said:

We resign Illyasova and THJr.   

 

 

On 7/12/2017 at 4:43 PM, Diesel said:

 Off the top, if I were ranking the SGs by production and potential, I would say it looks like this:

 

1.   Harden, 
2.  Butler, 
3.  Derozen
4. Thompson
5. Beal
6. Wade
7. McColloum
8. Booker
9. Wiggins
10. Batum
11. Hardaway Jr. 
12. Waiters
13. Fournier
14. Oladipo.
15. Reddick
16. Gordon
17. Lou Williams
18. Harris
19. Curry
20. Caldwell Pope. 

 

Now, the area where those guys appear is not an area in today's game where you will pay 11 Million.   Sorry.   So what I'm saying is that when you honestly rank production and potential, Hardaway Jr is right outside of the top 10 and top 10 money right now is just about where he's being paid. 

 

 

On 7/8/2017 at 6:45 AM, Diesel said:

If you won't resign THJr because of the Baze Contract...

Then you won't sign Jimmy Butler, CJ McCollum, Klay Thompson, or any other SG because of the Baze contract. 

 

Sorry, that's wrongheaded.  Especially when we're in need of Assets.  No FA wants to play for a rebuilding team.  Therefore, a rebuilding team has to collect the assets that it can. 

 

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, KB21 said:

I said good defenders.  John is not currently a good defender.

 

Just now, KB21 said:

No, I'm not.  I look at players and evaluate whether I think they have elite skills.  Markkanen's shooting is an elite skill for a 7 footer.  

Then who will protect the rim???  Isn't that what you have been crying about the entire thread???

[Diesel]

19 minutes ago, AHF said:

His numbers are some of the best in the last decade.  Not sure why you wouldn't.  Here is a post a did a month ago comparing freshmen PF/Cs from the last decade:

Rk	Player	Class	Season	School	PER	TS%	TRB%	AST%	STL%	BLK%	TOV%	USG%	ORtg	DRtg	WS/48
1	Karl-Anthony Towns	FR	2014-15	Kentucky	31.4	0.627	18.5	11.6	1.4	11.5	14.2	23.7	126.8	78.1	0.374
2	Anthony Davis	FR	2011-12	Kentucky	35.1	0.654	19	7.5	2.5	13.7	8.6	18.8	139	80.7	0.371
3	Zach Collins	FR	2016-17	Gonzaga	30.9	0.703	18.3	4.4	1.5	9.8	17.8	24.8	125.1	79.4	0.357
4	Mike Daum	FR	2015-16	South Dakota State	34.5	0.656	16.7	9.5	1.4	1.7	12.4	31.9	129	97.8	0.354
5	DeMarcus Cousins	FR	2009-10	Kentucky	34.2	0.579	22.5	9.2	2.4	7.5	13.6	30.5	118.5	83.9	0.349
6	Jared Sullinger	FR	2010-11	Ohio State	30.3	0.591	20.1	7.4	2	2	9.9	27	126	89.6	0.340
7	Cody Zeller	FR	2011-12	Indiana	31.3	0.665	14.9	9.5	2.9	4.3	12.4	24.3	132.1	96.3	0.318
8	DeAndre Ayton	FR	2017-18	Arizona	32.3	0.657	21.2	9.9	0.8	6.1	11.2	26.1	131.5	98.8	0.312
9	Marvin Bagley III	FR	2017-18	Duke	30.9	0.634	18.5	9.4	1.6	3.1	12.7	26.9	126.1	95.9	0.303
10	Jaren Jackson Jr.	FR	2017-18	Michigan State	27.4	0.654	14.7	9.4	1.7	14.5	17.4	23.8	121.2	86	0.295
11	Wendell Carter Jr.	FR	2017-18	Duke	29.1	0.638	18.7	13.3	1.5	7.9	15.7	22.6	127.2	92.8	0.294
12	Jameel Warney	FR	2012-13	Stony Brook	27.7	0.612	15.8	8.1	1.6	6.6	10.2	22	122.8	86.7	0.294
13	Anthony Bennett	FR	2012-13	Nevada-Las Vegas	28.3	0.609	17.1	8.8	1.5	4.6	12.3	27.5	117.6	89.6	0.288
14	Seth Tuttle	FR	2011-12	Northern Iowa	27.6	0.675	16.2	11.8	2.3	2.3	13.6	20.7	130.9	96.9	0.284
15	Lauri Markkanen	FR	2016-17	Arizona	25	0.635	14	5.6	0.8	1.8	8.1	22.4	134.1	100.4	0.282
16	Jahlil Okafor	FR	2014-15	Duke	30.7	0.641	16.6	9.4	1.5	4.5	15.6	27.6	119.9	95.4	0.281
17	Domantas Sabonis	FR	2014-15	Gonzaga	24.7	0.675	19.1	7.5	1.3	1.5	17.7	21.5	123.9	91.3	0.280
18	Cameron Krutwig	FR	2017-18	Loyola (IL)	25.1	0.632	16.8	14.8	1.3	3.6	13.8	22.3	124	93.1	0.279
19	D'Angelo Russell	FR	2014-15	Ohio State	26.6	0.573	9.8	30.1	2.8	1.1	14.8	30.2	115.7	94.5	0.275
20	Pascal Siakam	FR	2014-15	New Mexico State	26.1	0.614	15.7	10	1.7	5.9	15.3	21.2	122.7	92	0.270
21	Landry Shamet	FR	2016-17	Wichita State	20.2	0.629	5.8	22.2	1.6	0.9	10.7	18.8	132.1	95	0.270
22	TJ Leaf	FR	2016-17	UCLA	26.6	0.66	14.9	13.2	1.1	3.5	10.8	22	130.6	101.2	0.266
23	Devin Booker	FR	2014-15	Kentucky	19.4	0.6	5.4	10.9	1.3	0.3	10.4	22.8	123.1	92.2	0.265
24	James Thompson IV	FR	2015-16	Eastern Michigan	26.9	0.663	18	3.9	1.3	5.1	11.5	18.8	134.3	101.2	0.263
25	Ben McLemore	FR	2012-13	Kansas	23.2	0.633	9.4	12.6	1.8	2.2	14.2	23.2	121.4	93.7	0.262
26	Zhaire Smith	FR	2017-18	Texas Tech	23	0.63	9.8	11.5	2.3	4.4	11.3	18.4	129.7	95.1	0.260
27	Lonzo Ball	FR	2016-17	UCLA	24.7	0.673	9.3	31.4	2.8	2.1	18.6	18.1	131.3	100.7	0.258
28	Stanley Johnson	FR	2014-15	Arizona	22.5	0.551	14.1	11.6	3.2	1.6	14.7	26.6	111.1	87.6	0.253
29	Ivan Rabb	FR	2015-16	University of California	24.2	0.636	16.5	6.6	1.1	4.1	13.4	20	124.8	95.3	0.251
30	Mohamed Bamba	FR	2017-18	Texas	27.7	0.589	20	3.5	1.5	13	12.7	21.2	117.3	88.7	0.251
31	Ben Simmons	FR	2015-16	Louisiana State	29	0.6	18.2	27.4	3.1	2.5	17.4	26.4	117.2	98.4	0.250
32	Elias Harris	FR	2009-10	Gonzaga	24	0.609	13.7	7.9	1.8	1.6	13.3	24.2	118.7	95.5	0.250
33	Trae Young	FR	2017-18	Oklahoma	28.6	0.588	5.8	49	2.5	0.7	18.3	37.3	115.4	108.1	0.250
34	Melo Trimble	FR	2014-15	Maryland	22.8	0.628	6.8	21.2	2.3	0.2	16	25	120.7	99.1	0.250
35	C.J. McCollum	FR	2009-10	Lehigh	25.8	0.593	8.8	17.1	2.3	0.7	11	28.4	118.8	101.2	0.246
36	Temetrius Morant	FR	2017-18	Murray State	21.4	0.569	11.4	33.6	1.6	1	18.1	20.3	123.1	98.2	0.246
37	Jabari Parker	FR	2013-14	Duke	28.4	0.558	17.1	8.6	2.1	4	11.9	32.7	115	99.3	0.246
38	Rondae Hollis-Jefferson	FR	2013-14	Arizona	20.3	0.544	13.1	11	1.8	4.3	12.1	19.9	117.4	89.6	0.245
39	Tyler Haws	FR	2009-10	Brigham Young	20.4	0.62	9.1	10.3	1.6	0.6	11.4	19.3	127.9	97.8	0.244
40	Hassan Whiteside	FR	2009-10	Marshall	29.1	0.548	18.3	2.2	1.2	18.8	13.6	25.8	107.9	85.8	0.243

Who knew that Jared Sullinger was that damn good?

[Peoriabird]

17 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Again, give me examples of poor college defenders like Bagley and Ayton that became good defenders in the NBA.

Draymond green had 9 blocks total his freshman year

[KB21]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

 

Then who will protect the rim???  Isn't that what you have been crying about the entire thread???

You add a rim protector to play beside him, which is what I advocate with John Collins and pairing him with JJJ.