The Tank Thread

[Peoriabird]

59 minutes ago, AHF said:

For me Doncic is the guy on the board I want.  By a significant margin.  I think his floor is way higher than anyone else's and his ceiling is very nice too.  We've seen some MVP / All-NBA / All-Star players out of Europe and this guy is ahead of all of them at the same age.  Love his feel for the game.  Love his skills.   I don't think he is the next LeBron.  (Don't think that guy is in this draft). 

Whether a tradeup is worth it for him depends on the cost and I wouldn't be looking at our #1 next year.  But would I give up something like the T-Wolves pick or a lottery protected pick if I'm staring at Bagley, Bamba, Young, JJJ, Carter, Sexton and Bridges?  

I might trade back for that Bridges kid if we dropped too far back

[Diesel]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

We could have been run on the cheap this year.  Instead, ownership took on undesirable salary to pick up a first round pick and we ended up with a more expensive roster than when we were competing last year.

When you consider it... it's still running on the cheap by way of proxy. 

When you load up on 1st rounders, you're getting guaranteed cheap contracts of prospects.   You take up roster space and you can talk people out of seeking Free Agents. 

No need in going after Zach Lavine or Rodney Hood when we got Caleb Martin.  Caleb Martin is the future!!!

No need in going after Julius Randle when we got Robert Williams. 

 Williams, Martin, and Ayton are going to make Atlanta Great Again... Young and Exciting.   And very cheap.

 

 

[Peoriabird]

24 minutes ago, CBAreject said:

Arguing that Carter is not a lottery pick and that Sullinger was not a first round talent is silly.  The fact that Sullinger's career was shortened due to injuries says nothing about what level of talent he had as a prospect and where he was projected to go.  The "eye test" is also silly.  There are just a couple of guys each year who are eye-popping, but there are 14 lottery choices.  Most of them don't become NBA all-stars.  That's no knock on them, just a commentary on the rarity of NBA star talent.  Carter would be a lottery pick any year due to his size, skill, and production.  In years with thinner talent pools, he would be a top-5 pick.  Alex Len was a top-5 pick.  Absurd arguments here.  

Are their players that get into the lottery during lean years without being talented enough to be there..Of Course.  Are there number one pick in 1 draft that would be outside the lottery in others.. of course...That was not my argument.  My take is that there are true lottery players and there are players that don't belong and therefore should not be chosen there.  You either trade that spot to some other sucker or you make the playoffs to avoid being in that situation that particular year.  If I had to choose between taking JJJ, Carter, Young as earliest as they are projected,  I would either trade up or down to avoid them.  Same with Sullinger,  I would trade that pick like we traded Adreian Payne!

[AHF]

17 minutes ago, Diesel said:

When you consider it... it's still running on the cheap by way of proxy. 

When you load up on 1st rounders, you're getting guaranteed cheap contracts of prospects.   You take up roster space and you can talk people out of seeking Free Agents. 

No need in going after Zach Lavine or Rodney Hood when we got Caleb Martin.  Caleb Martin is the future!!!

No need in going after Julius Randle when we got Robert Williams. 

 Williams, Martin, and Ayton are going to make Atlanta Great Again... Young and Exciting.   And very cheap.

 

 

It is picking up cost controlled players but that doesn't determine your total payroll.  The Rams are loading up on expensive vets right now in the NFL because they have some key players on cost controlled contracts.  If we keep adding salary (live or dead), then that isn't running on the cheap even if we have a bunch of guys on 1st round contracts.  Whether we run on the cheap or not depends on the total player expense line on the budget.  This year -- not run on the cheap.  Next year and the years to come?  We'll see.

[AHF]

13 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Are their players that get into the lottery during lean years without being talented enough to be there..Of Course.  Are there number one pick in 1 draft that would be outside the lottery in others.. of course...That was not my argument.  My take is that there are true lottery players and there are players that don't belong and therefore should not be chosen there.  You either trade that spot to some other sucker or you make the playoffs to avoid being in that situation that particular year.  If I had to choose between taking JJJ, Carter, Young as earliest as they are projected,  I would either trade up or down to avoid them.  Same with Sullinger,  I would trade that pick like we traded Adreian Payne!

Carter was ranked #5-7 in his high school class depending on the service and was considered a definite lottery pick coming out of HS.  He had a great freshman year and now considered a definite lottery pick coming into the draft.  Nothing about that should be surprising.

[MaceCase]

1 hour ago, lethalweapon3 said:

Final profile pic of the regular season!

It was a great run for MMA fighter Tank Abbott, But I had to dump him after catching probably the worst 80s movie on cable late last night (whether it was on Starz or Movieplex or Skinemax, I can't recall. 'Twas all a blur.)

On the surface, Tank (1984), seemed perfect because it was filmed and set right here in Georgia! I mean, back before filming here was sexy, when all we had was Deliverance to hang our hats onto. Starring the late James Garner, Shirley Jones and a clueless C. Thomas Howell, where the protagonist, an Army sergeant, got all Our Lives Matter on an overbearing small-town sheriff after jailing his innocent son. He uses his restored WWII Sherman tank as his light saber to battle the baddies, as he and the family maps out an escape to the high-minded state of... Tennessee.

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: I cannot emphasize enough how thoroughly unwatchable this film is. Worst dialogue you could even imagine. Giving it any stars would be an insult to constellations everywhere. If you see this film in a Walmart bin somewhere, grab your cart and roll away as quickly as you can.

~lw3

Yeesh, if you were going for obscurity then former Stanford and Titan Safety Tank Williams should have been the pick.

[Peoriabird]

On 3/31/2018 at 10:34 AM, Buzzard said:

I do not think adding a few of rookies to this team will bring much improvement. Next season, I see a lot of the same. 30 wins if we play our best lineups every night. 20 to 25 if we throw in the towel.

The 3rd year, barring a big draft bust, is when I expect to chase the 8th seed.

There is no advantage to tanking so there will be no throwing in the towel

[NBASupes]

7 hours ago, KB21 said:

You add a rim protector to play beside him, which is what I advocate with John Collins and pairing him with JJJ.

Lol. This will be bad. 

Edited April 5, 2018 by NBASupes

[KB21]

37 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Lol. This will be bad. 

What's bad about pairing John Collins with the best defensive big by a large margin and also the best three point shooting big in this draft?

[KB21]

2 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

There is no advantage to tanking so there will be no throwing in the towel

The talent level of this team is so bad that, as hard as they may try, they will be fortunate to match this year's win total.

[NBASupes]

6 hours ago, KB21 said:

What's bad about pairing John Collins with the best defensive big by a large margin and also the best three point shooting big in this draft?

Because neither player really change Franchise outcomes. These guys will peak in the Shawn Kemp and Kevin Willis range. Neither are in that top tier category or close.

[AHF]

12 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

There is no advantage to tanking so there will be no throwing in the towel

Why do you say there is no advantage next year?  There is the exact same advantage of this year but the magnitude is less.  I.e., the odds are still weighted to the top and your worst case pick is still based on your pre-lottery position but the odds have flattened some so as to reduce the incentive but not eliminate it.

[Peoriabird]

6 minutes ago, AHF said:

Why do you say there is no advantage next year?  There is the exact same advantage of this year but the magnitude is less.  I.e., the odds are still weighted to the top and your worst case pick is still based on your pre-lottery position but the odds have flattened some so as to reduce the incentive but not eliminate it.

It won't be worth destroying your franchise with the lower odds

[AHF]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

I won't be worth destroying your franchise with the lower odds

I think most GMs willing to commit to the draft don't view it as destroying your franchise.  More a shortterm pain.  I am not confident this will eliminate tanking.

[Peoriabird]

Once is enough for me...I'm not that championship hungry...I thought it was the right thing to do because of our circumstance last year with older over priced players to start afresh.. I'm not going thru watching 7-8 g-leaguers perform on a nightly basis again this cycle.  I can only take so much

[KB21]

5 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Because neither player really change Franchise outcomes. These guys will peak in the Shawn Kemp and Kevin Willis range. Neither are in that top tier category or close.

But somehow Bagley is a top tier category player, even though he completely duplicates John Collins.  The only difference is that John wasn't hyped up by the media the way Bagley was coming out of AAU, and you have bought into the shoe company hype with him.

Quote

Bagley has high offensive potential as a play finisher if he plays the five in a kind of modern Amar’e Stoudemire role, but to optimize him requires a very specific ecosystem with a dynamic lead creator and defensive insulation. Assessing Bagley’s intelligence level and ability to pick up concepts quickly are critical inputs for any team in the pre-draft evaluation process because Bagley is FAR behind as a team defender to a potentially crippling level. Bagley’s motor and finishing intersection gives him a safe floor as a top-shelf energy big with skill, but in order to fully tap into his ceiling he’ll need to refine his perimeter game on offense mainly as a shooter and/or improve his defense to a respectable level. With the right fit next to a unicorn type Kristaps Porzingis big, Bagley could return elite value in this class. If he gets pigeonholed as a four in an Aaron Gordon type role, he likely won’t return top five value. Overall, drafting Bagley where he’ll likely go necessitates a plan to optimize him on offense. If a team can do that, his play finishing prowess could be impactful.

 

[KB21]

Bud did his best this year.  He turned a team that should have won around 16-17 games into a 22 win team despite his GM hand cuffing him at every opportunity.

Regardless, next year will be as bad or worse than this year, and those of you who wanted this pathway will get another high lottery pick and another overhyped, underdeveloped player that will not contribute to winning for 3 plus years.

[Peoriabird]

9 minutes ago, KB21 said:

But somehow Bagley is a top tier category player, even though he completely duplicates John Collins.  The only difference is that John wasn't hyped up by the media the way Bagley was coming out of AAU, and you have bought into the shoe company hype with him.

 

2 mobile bigs...Bud would be in heaven!

[Buzzard]

13 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

There is no advantage to tanking so there will be no throwing in the towel

We won't have to throw in the towel. I don't think we be a playoff team next season.

[NBASupes]

15 minutes ago, KB21 said:

But somehow Bagley is a top tier category player, even though he completely duplicates John Collins.  The only difference is that John wasn't hyped up by the media the way Bagley was coming out of AAU, and you have bought into the shoe company hype with him.

 

You keep quoting articles as if Bagley didn't improve his jumper during the season and as if he doesn't have all summer to improve in the off-season. He's not a duplicate Collins just based off the fact that he has a superior PF ceiling to Collins and he's an elite scoring player. Players with his quickness, speed, motor, ability and talent at his position aren't just rare, they simply haven't been seen before in the NBA. You don't pass on a star because it's unusual. Portland did that with Michael Jordan and it worked perfectly for them. 

 

Before Michael Jordan, we had no reference to Michael Jordan.

Edited April 5, 2018 by NBASupes