Building our winning Hawk team

[KB21]

4 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

Regardless of what profession we are talking about, from peon to president of a huge company, experience is a great teacher.  Many of our players, our head coach and his assistants have a lot to learn.

To judge them incapable without giving them time to prove themselves is bad.

OK.  So tell me this.  How many teams in the history of the NBA have been in a position where 3 rookies, 2 second year players, and a 3rd year player are major rotation pieces without any above average experienced veterans who can help those young players along have actually won and challenged for the playoffs with a rookie coach who has maybe 3 years of bench coach experience under his belt?

[KB21]

1 minute ago, nathan2331 said:

4 minutes ago, KB21 said:

No.

 

No, and lucky for them they didn't need to. Where would they be without Brown and Tatum had they not originally fleeced the Nets for those picks? Even the trade for Kyrie, they needed to add the Nets pick to Isaiah Thomas to get the deal done.

They would still be good.

[Peoriabird]

6 minutes ago, KB21 said:

No.

LOL! 

1) Damien Lee 26.9 M/G

2) Collins  24 M/G

3) Isaiah Taylor 17.4 M/G

4) Tyler Dorsey 17.4 M/G

5) Jalen Morris 16.3 M/G

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/ATL/2018.html

[nathan2331]

They would still be good.

If you want to think that, go right ahead.

[KB21]

12 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

LOL! 

1) Damien Lee 26.9 M/G

2) Collins  24 M/G

3) Isaiah Taylor 17.4 M/G

4) Tyler Dorsey 17.4 M/G

5) Jalen Morris 16.3 M/G

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/ATL/2018.html

Jaylen Morris played 98 minutes the entire season.  Damion Lee played 404 minutes.   Tyler Dorsey played 974 minutes. 

These players did not play major minutes outside of John Collins, who had over 1,700 minutes.

[RedDawg#8]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

LOL! 

1) Damien Lee 26.9 M/G

2) Collins  24 M/G

3) Isaiah Taylor 17.4 M/G

4) Tyler Dorsey 17.4 M/G

5) Jalen Morris 16.3 M/G

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/ATL/2018.html

Exact;y, and the only rookie that will see significant time is Young. Huerter and Spellman are in a deeper rotation at their prospective postions and the only way they will get more than 20 mins a game is if they earn it by balling out. 

 

[Peoriabird]

Just now, KB21 said:

Jaylen Morris played 98 minutes the entire season.  Damion Lee played 404 minutes.   Tyler Dorsey played 974 minutes. 

These players did not play major minutes outside of John Collins, who had over 1,700 minutes.

Collins, Taylor, and Dorsey were top 11 in total minutes on the roster.  Taylor played more minutes than Muscala and 8 fewer minutes than Ilyasova

[KB21]

Just now, Peoriabird said:

Collins, Taylor, and Dorsey were top 11 in total minutes on the roster.  Taylor played more minutes than Muscala and 8 fewer minutes than Ilyasova

Muscala was injured for a big part of the year, and Ilyasova was injured and then bought out.

The Hawks are looking at three rookies all getting over 1,500 minutes this year.  That is going to mean this team loses a lot of games.

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Collins, Taylor, and Dorsey were top 11 in total minutes on the roster.  Taylor played more minutes than Muscala and 8 fewer minutes than Ilyasova

Morris and Lee were not significant players.  Taylor, Delaney, Moose and Dorsey were all significant pieces in the rotation but not core players.  There is plenty of room for our rotation depth to improve over last year.

[KB21]

3 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Exact;y, and the only rookie that will see significant time is Young. Huerter and Spellman are in a deeper rotation at their prospective postions and the only way they will get more than 20 mins a game is if they earn it by balling out. 

 

This is a tanking team.  Young players play on tanking teams regardless of whether they have earned it or not.  It's one reason why proper player development doesn't happen in tanking environments/cultures.  

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

The Hawks are looking at three rookies all getting over 1,500 minutes this year.  That is going to mean this team loses a lot of games.

I don't know what makes you say retarded stuff like this.  Where will Huerter's minutes come from? Spellman will most likely spend some time in the G-league

[AHF]

4 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Muscala was injured for a big part of the year, and Ilyasova was injured and then bought out.

The Hawks are looking at three rookies all getting over 1,500 minutes this year.  That is going to mean this team loses a lot of games.

I also think the team will have growing pains this year.  (Don't think we will have 3 rookies with >1500 minutes though - I'd only expect Young to hit that number unless we deal Baze).  We'll all get to put our chips down in prediction thread once the roster is finalized and we are closer to heading into the season.  This should be a year where focus is more on development than wins so I think you and I will be lower on our prediction than Peoria, turner and others.  That will happen with the fanbase - different people, different opinions, different predictions.

[Jeffery123]

20 hours ago, sillent said:

We have Trae, Huerter, Prince, Adams, and some possibles that can shoot from 30 ft. Almost all of our players with the exclusion of Miles and probably Len can hit 3's. We have multiple good passers and playmakers at every position & the main question will be how long will it take us to get good chemistry? 

We have a young unselfish group and I think if they don't play with any personal egos and just within the team than we will be better than alot of people could/would guess. Tankers will be upset...... at 1st but who could be mad at watching their team win with a young core that is only going to get better? Just like some of us had to embrace the tank last yr I think tankers are going to have to embrace the effort this yr. In order to have a winning culture you have to win. We have some winners on our team and although young I think can be a force if they play as a unit. 39 WINS I said it 1st. 

My prediction is 42, f**k the tank.  This team is leaps and bounds better than  last years team.

[Gray Mule]

I don't expect this current Hawks team to be in the playoffs, challenging for the title.  They are not mature enough for that.  Not yet.  But, I still believe that they may be good enough to squeak into 8th place.  That would mean that they would meet the #1 eastern team in the first round.  If that happens, Atlanta would be very lucky to win one playoff game.

That being said, think of the experience that would give these very young lads.  And their coaches.

Being healthy for the entire season is key to any NBA team.  Atlanta's team last season had a lot of players miss a lot of games, as already mentioned here.  New cars come with a warranty.  New NBA players do not.  Already, we have questions about Jeremy's health and well being.

[turnermx]

My prediction is 42, f**k the tank.  This team is leaps and bounds better than  last years team.

 

This is the way I see it if we have guys ball out the way I expect if they can stay on the court(especially in the cases of Bembry and Lin. My ideal situation is getting a 6-10 pick from Dallas, hopefully Cleveland’s as well and Hawks pick being in the teens.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[JayBirdHawk]

2 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Didn't Cavanaugh, Taylor, Lee, Dorsey, and Collins play major minutes last year?

I understand what you are saying, but their minutes per game are skewed. There total minutes tell a different story.

Injuries to guys like Dedmon, Moose and Illy plus the trade deadline moves and sitting starters constituted to their high mpg. Also factor in they were also playing with vets.  The new younger talented guys will be playing with more younger guys of the same ilk.

New 1st time coach plus a plethora of 19-21 year olds all have a lot to learn.

 

2 hours ago, Gray Mule said:

Regardless of what profession we are talking about, from peon to president of a huge company, experience is a great teacher.  Many of our players, our head coach and his assistants have a lot to learn.

To judge them incapable without giving them time to prove themselves is bad.

Yes.

[Peoriabird]

32 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Also factor in they were also playing with vets.  The new younger talented guys will be playing with more younger guys of the same ilk.

New 1st time coach plus a plethora of 19-21 year olds all have a lot to learn.

 

Why do y'all keep saying this???  The starting line up will most likely be

            Starters                                                   Back up                                   3rd string

PG     Jeremy Lin                                              Trae Young                                 Free agent signing

SG     Kent Bazemore                                      Deandre Bembry                        Tyler Dorsey/Kevin Huerter

SM    Taurean Prince                                        Justin Anderson                         Deandre Bembry

PF     John Collins                                            Free agent signing                      Omari Spellman

C       Dwayne Dedmon                                   Alex Len                                        Miles Plumlee

 

Where are all of these young line up you guys speak of????

[JayBirdHawk]

3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Why do y'all keep saying this???  The starting line up will most likely be

            Starters                                                   Back up                                   3rd string

PG     Jeremy Lin                                              Trae Young                                 Free agent signing

SG     Kent Bazemore                                      Deandre Bembry                        Tyler Dorsey/Kevin Huerter

SM    Taurean Prince                                        Justin Anderson                         Deandre Bembry

PF     John Collins                                            Free agent signing                      Omari Spellman

C       Dwayne Dedmon                                   Alex Len                                        Miles Plumlee

 

Where are all of these young line up you guys speak of????

Because you keep throwing out the 10 dayers annd GLers as if they got 'quality' minutes last season. They played because of injury (Cavanaugh 39 total games)  and trades of our vets. Anything after Beli and Illy were traded...meh.  So saying Jaylen Morris played 17 mpg means squat when he played 6 total games.

Our 3 1st round picks plus Collins, Prince, Bembry and Dorsey are expected to get quality minutes and have it mean something to their development.

Example: Before the deadline: Collins backed up Illyasova,who couldn't stay on the floor because of all the fouling, now he's starting backed up by Spellman. Beli backed up Baze...now one of Huerter and Dorsey will back up Baze.  Dennis was backed up by Delaney and Taylor, now Lin is backed up by  a 19 year old Young.

Individually the new players may be more talented but youth matters in wins and losses. That's all I'm trying to say.

[Peoriabird]

15 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Because you keep throwing out the 10 dayers annd GLers as if they got 'quality' minutes last season. They played because of injury (Cavanaugh 39 total games)  and trades of our vets. Anything after Beli and Illy were traded...meh.  So saying Jaylen Morris played 17 mpg means squat when he played 6 total games.

Our 3 1st round picks plus Collins, Prince, Bembry and Dorsey are expected to get quality minutes and have it mean something to their development.

Example: Before the deadline: Collins backed up Illyasova,who couldn't stay on the floor because of all the fouling, now he's starting backed up by Spellman. Beli backed up Baze...now one of Huerter and Dorsey will back up Baze.  Dennis was backed up by Delaney and Taylor, now Lin is backed up by  a 19 year old Young.

Individually the new players may be more talented but youth matters in wins and losses. That's all I'm trying to say.

Isaiah Taylor was top 8 in total minutes played... only 8 minutes fewer than Iyasova.  Collins played the 4th most minutes 4 minutes fewer than Bazemore.  Even Dorsey played more minutes than Moose at almost 1000 minutes last season.  The Total number of rookie minutes last year equaled 5,413.  Our 3 rookies would have to average 1,804 or 22 minutes per game each to equal the total from last year which is very unlikely!!!

[KB21]

The starters will be Young, Baze, Prince, Collins, and Dedmond with Lin, Huerter, and Spellman being the first three off the bench.