Official 2019 Draft thread

[NBASupes]

So much of this draft is where these dudes go. Middleton was drafted by DET. Wasn't nothing for them. Went to MIL. Fought in practice everyday v. Giannis when both wanted to make it. It made him much better for it. So much has to go right. 

You draft someone, give them high expectations, they just whatevers, they will get attacked on social media or in the locker room, they looked at, damn, you suppose to be better than this. It's f*cks up their career. 

So much goes into making a great NBA player. It's not just simple like here, take him. System, fit, personalities, styles, vision, etc. This is one of those drafts where I can see some 2nd rounders being one of the best in the class.

[RedDawg#8]

I think what helps us the most with a draft like this is having a coach in Lloyd Pierce who excels in player development. A guy like Cam would be pushed everyday to speed up and make faster, smarter decisions which, with his current skill set, could make him lethal. 

Also, already having a Trae Young on board means we don’t need anyone coming in to be a primary option right away. Our bread and butter is Trae Young pick and roll w/ John Collins. Our offense runs through those 2 and everything else plays off that. So, so what if there is no superstar past 3. Trae is your superstar, John is your all star. Having an elite ceiling type player like a Cam, Sekou, or whoever else will be able to grow in to their potential versus be rushed in to proving themselves. 

Huerter was a great example of how our draft class will be able to grow in to their game alongside guys with more immediate “IT” factors. 

We have to hit on our picks for sure, but they don’t have to be great right away, we are built to be able to develop these guys unlike our lottery counterparts who NEED a guy to get excited about right away.

[NBASupes]

6 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

I think what helps us the most with a draft like this is having a coach in Lloyd Pierce who excels in player development. A guy like Cam would be pushed everyday to speed up and make faster, smarter decisions which, with his current skill set, could make him lethal. 

Also, already having a Trae Young on board means we don’t need anyone coming in to be a primary option right away. Our bread and butter is Trae Young pick and roll w/ John Collins. Our offense runs through those 2 and everything else plays off that. So, so what if there is no superstar past 3. Trae is your superstar, John is your all star. Having an elite ceiling type player like a Cam, Sekou, or whoever else will be able to grow in to their potential versus be rushed in to proving themselves. 

Huerter was a great example of how our draft class will be able to grow in to their game alongside guys with more immediate “IT” factors. 

We have to hit on our picks for sure, but they don’t have to be great right away, we are built to be able to develop these guys unlike our lottery counterparts who NEED a guy to get excited about right away.

He is a reaction player, you really can't speed them up. You just gotta put them in plus situations for their skillset which is vast for Reddish. 

The offensive gravity of Trae is already top 10 in the NBA and likely to be top 3-5 next season. Yeah, Reddish or any rookie will benefit from that. Especially Reddish who is elite and rare in space. 

Kevin is a prime example how you can extremely improve during the season. 

I agree. 100%

[Spud2nique]

Culver is the jewel of this draft. Trae and Culver in the ATL. I can already see it. All star backcourt for years. Kabengele will drop but shouldn’t. Clarke is a man.

41.5 hours remaining...

[NBASupes]

Just now, Spud2nique said:

Culver is the jewel of this draft. Trae and Culver in the ATL. I can already see it. All star backcourt for years. Kabengele will drop but shouldn’t. Clarke is a man.

41.5 hours remaining...

Culver will disappoint you man if your expecting greatness. If you are expecting a solid player, you should be good but this jewel of a player. It's not him. He's just a role player at this level. 

Kevin is better right now and will be forever compared to Culver. 

[Spud2nique]

22 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Culver will disappoint you man if your expecting greatness. If you are expecting a solid player, you should be good but this jewel of a player. It's not him. He's just a role player at this level. 

Kevin is better right now and will be forever compared to Culver. 

I guess we will have to agree to disagree and revisit this in a few years. I think he’s gonna be a perennial all star ️. I think he’s the only one we fully disagree. We both on with Cam and Clarke. 41 hours to go. Should be fun.

[NBASupes]

5 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

I guess we will have to agree to disagree and revisit this in a few years. I think he’s gonna be a perennial all star ️. I think he’s the only one we fully disagree. We both on with Cam and Clarke. 41 hours to go. Should be fun.

You buying into draft day hype like I did when our best option was Kelly Oubre. I knew from the tape he was limited but at 15, all of the good stuff was gone so I had to sell myself on Save A Lot meat. That's all you doing with Culver. Nothing about him screams star. All of his elite traits are NBA meaningless and his archetype is pretty good, he likely won't be that good. 

Even all of the draftniks who love him start to scramble for good expectations for him as his game is more prone to becoming a role player. On ball, he doesn't have an solid first step, and he is not explosive at all. It likes to play bully ball like Khris Middleton and Paul Pierce but they were 20 pounds bigger at the same stage and just gained 20 more pounds again in the NBA after that. 

All of his best traits are meaningless in terms of stardom but they are very important in terms of successful and effective role players. There is  nothing wrong with that. Effective role players are hard to find. Look at ours like Bazemore and Bembry that's limited as hell. Effective only in spurts for the most part. Just imagine if these two were consistently effective.

He will make a lot of money playing this way and that's a positive. 

His biggest issue is and has always been for me. Too skinny and not enough measurables for his style of play. Best position is lead guard as even as a secondary playmaker, he is simply not skilled enough to be super effective. 

A lot of people who love him kinda have this approach to him like Cam I've noticed and I don't like either of it. Sorry Bulls or Cavs, playing in the NBA isn't the space that's going to help Cam get to his ceiling. I understand the talent after 3 is underwhelming but it's not. He needs elite offensive overall gravity. 

Sorry Culver fans but Jarrett is not going to turn into Klay or some great shooter. He is projected to be a worse 3pt shooter than Stanley Johnson. While I understand you may like his game, there is a great chance he will struggle from 3 in the NBA with his shooting speed, lack of shooting explosiveness and need for space when shooting from distance. 

Realization of these things are critical. In draft season, every year we sunny side up prospects unless they really got it. When they got it, we do the opposite. Hilarious. 

[kg01]

kg's musings ...

Considering CLP's quotes regarding 'uncoachability' of guys in workouts causing them to drop off the board ...

.. and his quotes in reference to the Clarke guy ... could it be that Clarke dropped off our board?

I speculated it was The Destroyer that he was referring to but now I think it was Clarke.  Take that, @Spud2nique

The Destroyer is still on the board!

 

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

36 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

You buying into draft day hype like I did when our best option was Kelly Oubre. I knew from the tape he was limited but at 15, all of the good stuff was gone so I had to sell myself on Save A Lot meat. That's all you doing with Culver. Nothing about him screams star. All of his elite traits are NBA meaningless and his archetype is pretty good, he likely won't be that good. 

Even all of the draftniks who love him start to scramble for good expectations for him as his game is more prone to becoming a role player. On ball, he doesn't have an solid first step, and he is not explosive at all. It likes to play bully ball like Khris Middleton and Paul Pierce but they were 20 pounds bigger at the same stage and just gained 20 more pounds again in the NBA after that. 

All of his best traits are meaningless in terms of stardom but they are very important in terms of successful and effective role players. There is  nothing wrong with that. Effective role players are hard to find. Look at ours like Bazemore and Bembry that's limited as hell. Effective only in spurts for the most part. Just imagine if these two were consistently effective.

He will make a lot of money playing this way and that's a positive. 

His biggest issue is and has always been for me. Too skinny and not enough measurables for his style of play. Best position is lead guard as even as a secondary playmaker, he is simply not skilled enough to be super effective. 

A lot of people who love him kinda have this approach to him like Cam I've noticed and I don't like either of it. Sorry Bulls or Cavs, playing in the NBA isn't the space that's going to help Cam get to his ceiling. I understand the talent after 3 is underwhelming but it's not. He needs elite offensive overall gravity. 

Sorry Culver fans but Jarrett is not going to turn into Klay or some great shooter. He is projected to be a worse 3pt shooter than Stanley Johnson. While I understand you may like his game, there is a great chance he will struggle from 3 in the NBA with his shooting speed, lack of shooting explosiveness and need for space when shooting from distance. 

Realization of these things are critical. In draft season, every year we sunny side up prospects unless they really got it. When they got it, we do the opposite. Hilarious. 

I think the Hawks like Culver more for his defense and they have acknowledged that he needs to develop a 3pt shot in order to be effective.  I'd rather go after Reddish or trade up and hope Barrett falls to 4-6. I don't think Barrett makes in past New Orleans pick at 4. The draft experts compare Reddish to Rudy Gay who I like, but never reached his full potential.

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[NBASupes]

47 minutes ago, PSSSHHHRRR87 said:

I think the Hawks like Culver more for his defense and they have acknowledged that he needs to develop a 3pt shot in order to be effective.  I'd rather go after Reddish or trade up and hope Barrett falls to 4-6. I don't think Barrett makes in past New Orleans pick at 4. The draft experts compare Reddish to Rudy Gay who I like, but never reached his full potential.

Developing his three point results are likely to be on par with Bazemore development. Complete rehaul need and I am still not a believer. 

I don't even think he is as sure of thing like Rudy Gay was but he is clearly better than Gay day 1 as well. Gay flaws was revolved around trying to force his PF skillset in his SF frame. Reddish flaws are completely different. He has a guard skillset in a big wing body. Gay name is synonymous with talented flawed wing but they really aren't comparable at all.

 

[txsting]

Reddish has zero dog in him.  Like negative dog ratio.  Like Marvin level dog.  I think Marvin is the best comparison for him.

Some sucker will draft him high based on "potential"; hope it isn't us.  

[txsting]

How do you play 30 minutes in college basketball at 6'8" and not even grab 4 rebounds a game?  Rebounding is one of the best predictors that we have to analyze a player, it translates well across different levels of basketball.  Why?  Because it is effort and desire.  

Culver was asked to do everything for his team.  Score, make plays, defend.  And he still grabbed over 6 boards a game.  He is an all around player who has desire and love to go with really interesting talent and basketball skill.  

Cam will blow you away in a workout.  Like Yi Jianlian.  Exactly like Yi.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

kg's musings ...

Considering CLP's quotes regarding 'uncoachability' of guys in workouts causing them to drop off the board ...

.. and his quotes in reference to the Clarke guy ... could it be that Clarke dropped off our board?

I speculated it was The Destroyer that he was referring to but now I think it was Clarke.  Take that, @Spud2nique

The Destroyer is still on the board!

 

Clarke Kent>Goganani 

Superman 🦸‍ 

[txsting]

Last point, i guarantee you that Billy Knight would be trading everything to get his hands on Cam Reddish.

[AHF]

I'm not a Marvin fan but since he is being thrown out as a cautionary tale, bear in mind that Marvin would have been a much nicer pick at 8 or 10.

For his draft class, he is #4 in career WS, #8 in career VORP, #12 in career BPM, #8 in career points (on a healthy 54.7% TS%, #4 rebounds, #10 assists.  He was a fine late lottery role player.  Problem was being taken #2 over multiple All-Stars.

[kg01]

12 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Clarke Kent>Goganani 

Superman 🦸‍ 

Heh, smells like CLP disagrees.

18 minutes ago, txsting said:

Reddish has zero dog in him.  Like negative dog ratio.  Like Marvin level dog.  I think Marvin is the best comparison for him.

Some sucker will draft him high based on "potential"; hope it isn't us.  

Eh, it's more nuanced than that.  Looks like the dude was playing injured and he hasn't worked out because of it.

I hadn't been a fan of his at all, because of some of the misconceptions you mentioned.  Then I watched him play.  What impressed me was his defense.  6'8" and guarding lead guards.  That's energy/effort/skill.  Was a good passer and has shooting form that should translate.

So the "hype", I imagine, is more so that type of stuff.  Not necessarily the Billy Knight-esque wing/workout infatuation.

[Spud2nique]

Just now, kg01 said:

Heh, smells like CLP disagrees.

Eh, it's more nuanced than that.  Looks like the dude was playing injured and he hasn't worked out because of it.

I hadn't been a fan of his at all, because of some of the misconceptions you mentioned.  Then I watched him play.  What impressed me was his defense.  6'8" and guarding lead guards.  That's energy/effort/skill.  Was a good passer and has shooting form that should translate.

So the "hype", I imagine, is more so that type of stuff.  Not necessarily the Billy Knight-esque wing/workout infatuation.

CLP disagrees? What did he say about Clarke? I missed it. How, why...  

[AHF]

Just now, kg01 said:

Heh, smells like CLP disagrees.

Eh, it's more nuanced than that.  Looks like the dude was playing injured and he hasn't worked out because of it.

I hadn't been a fan of his at all, because of some of the misconceptions you mentioned.  Then I watched him play.  What impressed me was his defense.  6'8" and guarding lead guards.  That's energy/effort/skill.  Was a good passer and has shooting form that should translate.

So the "hype", I imagine, is more so that type of stuff.  Not necessarily the Billy Knight-esque wing/workout infatuation.

Some of what you'd expect Cam to do was filled by RJ as well.  If RJ wasn't there, he would likely have guarded more wings and had more time closer to the basket to improve his rebounding numbers.   Every minute guarding perimeter guards was a severely diminished opportunity to grab boards.

Just now, Spud2nique said:

CLP disagrees? What did he say about Clarke? I missed it. How, why...  

kg has reinterpreted CLP's comment about uncoachable players as applying to Clarke.  You won't find any direct comments from coach.

[kg01]

3 minutes ago, AHF said:

kg has reinterpreted CLP's comment about uncoachable players as applying to Clarke.  You won't find any direct comments from coach.

 

3 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

CLP disagrees? What did he say about Clarke? I missed it. How, why...  

No, someone posted the quote here but now I can't find it.  CLP said, on Clarke, that he's not going to play 5 in the NBA.  That he was too small, etc.

Why can't I find the post now?