Official Game Thread: Nuggets at Hawks

[kg01]

21 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Their last game in the playoffs last year would be the best example of that when they went to him every time down the stretch and he just went cold. Series done. That said this guy is still only 24 years old so certainly no book on him can be closed. Think he can probably keep a team fighting for a spot in that WCF series each year. Not so sure about more than that though.

Them advancing depends on Murray imho.  Can't depend on Jokic scoring, especially down the stretch.  In that regard, Murray has been a little disappointing too.  Expected him to challenge for an all-star spot this year.  Harris hasn't progressed either.  He's just a guy.

Fortunately for them, DEN has a depth of talent that allows them to keep playing at a high enough level.  Won't be enough in the playoffs when rotations get tightened.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

b) recognizing we're a donut (got a hole in the middle?  c'mon, keep up).

People used to say this to me in middle school that the Hawks were a donut because of Koncak.  

On the contrary, Jokic played a fantastic brand of basketball in the playoffs last spring and  the Nuggets should have probably advanced to the conf finals against the scrubs.

Heres my thing with Jokic. Is he fat? For sure, is he out of shape, I’m not sure. Guys like Vlade Divac used to smoke and not work out yet thrive because of one thing: SKILL

Jokic is a skilled player and a dangerous one at that and I’d love to pair him with Trae if at all possible in the future. Best passing guard playing with the best passing center. We would be nearly impossible to defend.

Jokic>Embiid>KAT>Drummond

Thats how I look at it.

[kg01]

6 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

People used to say this to me in middle school that the Hawks were a donut because of Koncak.  

On the contrary, Jokic played a fantastic brand of basketball in the playoffs last spring and  the Nuggets should have probably advanced to the conf finals against the scrubs.

Heres my thing with Jokic. Is he fat? For sure, is he out of shape, I’m not sure. Guys like Vlade Divac used to smoke and not work out yet thrive because of one thing: SKILL

Jokic is a skilled player and a dangerous one at that and I’d love to pair him with Trae if at all possible in the future. Best passing guard playing with the best passing center. We would be nearly impossible to defend.

Jokic>Embiid>KAT>Drummond

Thats how I look at it.

Funny thing is Embiid is also out of shape.  If he were in shape, he blows them all out of the water.

I'm not concerned about how he looks, I'm concerned about his stamina and resulting wear and tear.  Not many bigs have his skill level but it won't matter if he's shelved due to injury or shelved because he's suckin' wind and sweatin' gravy.

ETA: And I see what you're doing with your rankings by putting Jok and Kitty on there.  Trying to curry favor with @Sothron.  Well, it's not gonna work.  saphron is my guy.  He's the reason I came to this site.

That's right folks, everything I do, you an blame saphron. 

Edited January 7, 2020 by kg01

[Thomas]

9 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

People used to say this to me in middle school that the Hawks were a donut because of Koncak.  

On the contrary, Jokic played a fantastic brand of basketball in the playoffs last spring and  the Nuggets should have probably advanced to the conf finals against the scrubs.

Heres my thing with Jokic. Is he fat? For sure, is he out of shape, I’m not sure. Guys like Vlade Divac used to smoke and not work out yet thrive because of one thing: SKILL

Jokic is a skilled player and a dangerous one at that and I’d love to pair him with Trae if at all possible in the future. Best passing guard playing with the best passing center. We would be nearly impossible to defend.

Jokic>Embiid>KAT>Drummond

Thats how I look at it.

Did you see the fourth quarter of Denver's last playoff game last year? That is why there are some questions about elite status for him. But as you said, with what is going on now I would love to have a cat in the middle that can shoot, rebound and pass. He has more than we have with all of our bigs put together in that C spot. 

[Spud2nique]

6 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Did you see the fourth quarter of Denver's last playoff game last year? That is why there are some questions about elite status for him. But as you said, with what is going on now I would love to have a cat in the middle that can shoot, rebound and pass. He has more than we have with all of our bigs put together in that C spot. 

Ya they totally fell apart vs the Blazers. I mean I was rooting for the Nuggets because I knew they would give more against the Warriors but we will never know.

I think he fits well with us for a few reasons and beyond the obvious ones about his skill set, it’s his ability to fade in and out of the spotlight that gives his guys a chance to shine. Now, if that’s intentional, he’s kind of a basketball genius and motivator, if it’s because he’s suckin wind , then he needs to get off that @Sothron and @kg01 2020 seafood diet...they see food and they eat it.... 

And that joke there...right there is why I’m pencilled in BEHIND @JayBirdHawk at ur local laugh factory.

Oh, my point @Thomas was that if Trae is an alpha which we know that he is, we need a skilled big that will understand the give and take and still allow Trae to be Trae. I think Jokic would do that better than anyone in the league if you are pairing Trae with anyone and that includes Giannis...ok maybe not Giannis he’s a freak, but everyone else. Jokic has the ego and the game to take a backseat to Trae and have us be successful. Having said that, @Sothron knows that Denver views Jokic as we do Trae, untouchable and would do anything to keep him so it’s likely a moot point anyways I’m just saying if I had my pick of the litter... outside of the obvious Giannis, Jokic might be #2.

[Thomas]

7 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Oh, my point @Thomas was that if Trae is an alpha which we know that he is, we need a skilled big that will understand the give and take and still allow Trae to be Trae. I think Jokic would do that better than anyone in the league if you are pairing Trae with anyone and that includes Giannis...ok maybe not Giannis he’s a freak, but everyone else. Jokic has the ego and the game to take a backseat to Trae and have us be successful. Having said that, @Sothron knows that Denver views Jokic as we do Trae, untouchable and would do anything to keep him so it’s likely a moot point anyways I’m just saying if I had my pick of the litter... outside of the obvious Giannis, Jokic might be #2.

We would certainly be a bet to out pass and out score opponents each night. His two way rebounding would offset a good bit of his so so defensive (being polite here). Like you said though, appears to be one of our pipe dreams because who in their right mind would watch him walk. If they trade him the fans would never ever forget it. FO would immediately become temps.

[Sothron]

Jokic intentionally takes the foot off the pedal in games to let his teammates get their shots and he becomes a distributor. That isn't him being out of gas. That is intentional. He's done this in every team he's been on going back to him being a kid. He wants his teammates to get involved and doesn't want to be THAT guy jacking up shots every trip down the court.

Jokic on the Hawks with Trae would be a NBA wet dream for me. Joker doesn't have the mentality that he has to score 20-30 a night to feel involved. He would feed as a point center to Trae and our wings. My God the pick and screen game between Joker and Ice Trae would be so filthy they'd have to ban it.

There's no way in hell that's happening. Joker is an elite superstar and the fans in Denver would riot if they traded him. 

[Spud2nique]

3 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Jokic intentionally takes the foot off the pedal in games to let his teammates get their shots and he becomes a distributor.

Yup. It seems nobody wants to take the reigns and run with it even on nights when he wants them to get it going. Mainly falls on Jamal Murray. Although I like their scheme as a team, team ball, team stats, team wins. That’s how it should be in my opinion. Swing that puppy senseless until a great shot opens up.

[Peoriabird]

22 hours ago, Gray Mule said:

For all you history buffs, remember reading about the battle flag the USA once had:

"DON'T TREAD ON ME."

Denver's center, Jokic, apparently had this memorial flag on the back of his shirt last night.

Bruno tried.  Alex tried.  Damian tried.  John tried.  Four Hawk centers all tried and all had a hand in Jokic shooting 16 free throws.  He got 11 of them and hit 16 of 25 from the floor, including 4 threes. 

Lloyd Pierce noted the many whistles the Denver men got.  I remember one call against a Hawk when he just clearly touched only the ball, knocking it out of bounds.  This happened just after LP used his one challenge where the Denver player traveled, then John fouled him.  The foul call stood.  Apparently, the fact that he walked didn't enter into the check.

Grumble.  Growl.  Grumble.  Growl.  All in all, Hawks played a great game.  Seems that these better teams (they all qualify when facing Atlanta) get the benefit on the calls.  Bad calls are supposed to balance out.  Each team getting a like number of calls.  Being a blind, homer Hawk fan, I begin to wonder.

Oh, well, off we go to the next one.

GO ATL HAWKS !!

 

 

It ain't the refs y'all...Our front court is the worst in the league.

[Gray Mule]

15 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

I ain't the refs y'all...Our front court is the worst in the league.

True, the refs are not the cause of many losses. Our center position is the weakest link in our chain.  Sometimes, when the Hawks lose a close game and all the calls seem to go against the Hawks, I believe that we, as fans, have reason to grumble.  

Why, do you suppose, do the Atlanta Hawks seem to get the short end of the stick?  Could it be that we are usually thought of as the lesser team?  As we improve, perhaps the calls will improve also.

Yes, this year's Hawk team is down and downtrodden.  How many games have they played with the entire roster available?  And, with Bruno missing because of family death and another Hawk out for 2 weeks with a non surgery health problem, we will not, any time soon, be 100% available.

Having a very young, inexperienced roster and always missing pieces makes for a terrible combination....

[Peoriabird]

10 hours ago, Gray Mule said:

 And, with Bruno missing because of family death
 

Bruno isn't NBA grade yet.  Shouldn't even be playing at the NBA level.  Dude belongs in the G-league

[Plainview1981]

On 1/6/2020 at 10:50 PM, Watchman said:

Magic Johnson disagrees.

You can find a couple of exceptions. Awesome. 

Magic played on a loaded team.

Joker is a great passer, but not much of anything else... Good rebounder? Yes... Dominate? No.  Good scorer? Yes... Great one? No.

Good defender? No.... 

Is he the kind of player that millions will follow? No. 

He doesn’t have the accomplishments, production or entertainment value that makes one a superstar.

 

 

Edited January 9, 2020 by Plainview1981

[Sothron]

1 hour ago, Plainview1981 said:

You can find a couple of exceptions. Awesome. 

Magic played on a loaded team.

Joker is a great passer, but not much of anything else... Good rebounder? Yes... Dominate? No.  Good scorer? Yes... Great one? No.

Good defender? No.... 

Is he the kind of player that millions will follow? No. 

He doesn’t have the accomplishments, production or entertainment value that makes one a superstar.

 

 

This is just silly. Jokic carried them to the playoffs last year and will carry them again. When he wants to score he scores on anyone in the NBA. When he wants to pass he is by far the best passing big man in the history of basketball. He's a good rebounder and a decent defender. That's a superstar.

[macdaddy]

9 hours ago, Sothron said:

This is just silly. Jokic carried them to the playoffs last year and will carry them again. When he wants to score he scores on anyone in the NBA. When he wants to pass he is by far the best passing big man in the history of basketball. He's a good rebounder and a decent defender. That's a superstar.

He's a star.  I'd say to be a superstar the average sports fan needs to know your name.  He doesn't pass that test yet.  

[Plainview1981]

16 hours ago, Sothron said:

This is just silly. Jokic carried them to the playoffs last year and will carry them again. When he wants to score he scores on anyone in the NBA. When he wants to pass he is by far the best passing big man in the history of basketball. He's a good rebounder and a decent defender. That's a superstar.

Sorry, I disagree.

This isn’t a shot against him. I just have stricter standards for what I call a superstar.

Saying he could do this or he could do that. Until he does, it’s hearsay.

I stand by what I said.

 

[AHF]

I put Jokic in the same category as I did prime Kevin Love, even though I like him better than Love given his passing.  He is a great offensive player but not so prolific as to be able to turn a playoff series and he is adequate on defense.  I don't consider him in the top tier of NBA players (Kawhi, LeBron, healthy AD, etc.) but think he is in the mix of the second tier.