One thing that I found curious.....

[Diesel]

Nobody said anything but we took the time to work out SGs??  (The guy out of TN and another guy). 

Shooting Guards??

With us having Bogi, Cam, Heurter... why???  Not one... but 2. 

Maybe it suggests that a trade is in the works?  The thing was that as I looked at them, neither guy ran offenses.   Just shooting Guards. 

Right now, I can't be surprised.   I can't be surprised if we ARE trying to move up in the lottery or if we do have our eyes on a trade for an established Vet. 

What do you think?

 

[Gray Mule]

25 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Nobody said anything but we took the time to work out SGs??  (The guy out of TN and another guy). 

Shooting Guards??

With us having Bogi, Cam, Heurter... why???  Not one... but 2. 

Maybe it suggests that a trade is in the works?  The thing was that as I looked at them, neither guy ran offenses.   Just shooting Guards. 

Right now, I can't be surprised.   I can't be surprised if we ARE trying to move up in the lottery or if we do have our eyes on a trade for an established Vet. 

What do you think?

 

I'm with you.  I will not be really surprised, regardless of what our GM does.  Why?  Because I believe that he knows what he's doing better than most of us Squawk posters.  Not saying anything bad about us.  Just thinking about how good everything has worked out so far.

[thecampster]

30 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Nobody said anything but we took the time to work out SGs??  (The guy out of TN and another guy). 

Shooting Guards??

With us having Bogi, Cam, Heurter... why???  Not one... but 2. 

Maybe it suggests that a trade is in the works?  The thing was that as I looked at them, neither guy ran offenses.   Just shooting Guards. 

Right now, I can't be surprised.   I can't be surprised if we ARE trying to move up in the lottery or if we do have our eyes on a trade for an established Vet. 

What do you think?

 

So we invite 3 players at a time in we've got interest in and 3 others.  Usually 1 big, 1 wing and 1 PG/SG.  Most of the team workouts involve individual play, 1v1, 3v3 drills.  Teams are looking at everything from stamina/heart to aggression to teamwork and being coachable.  Sometimes teams bring in a 1st round talent expected to go after they pick, just to work out the 2nd round talent they are looking and see how he matches up.  

 

In the event we don't welcome 3 main and 3 competitive players, typically a coach steps into the "opponent" role. Of the 40 or 50 players a team brings in, they are typically only looking at 10-12.

So your first question is...why would a 1st round pick go somewhere that may not pick him?  1, you never know whose mind you'll change and bump your worth. 2, you never know what local media might say about you that might bump your worth. 3, you never, ever want to be labeled the guy that doesn't want to play, compete, tryout. 4. your handlers will push you to take as many of these visits as possible and push your most serious visits back in the process some. This allows you to feel how teams will work you out and give  you a chance to impress others later, let your team know any red flags about your cooperation effort, mechanics, etc they might see.

[thecampster]

38 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Nobody said anything but we took the time to work out SGs??  (The guy out of TN and another guy). 

Shooting Guards??

With us having Bogi, Cam, Heurter... why???  Not one... but 2. 

Maybe it suggests that a trade is in the works?  The thing was that as I looked at them, neither guy ran offenses.   Just shooting Guards. 

Right now, I can't be surprised.   I can't be surprised if we ARE trying to move up in the lottery or if we do have our eyes on a trade for an established Vet. 

What do you think?

 

Take this with a grain of salt but if I had to gauge what we're doing its likely broke down like this.

50% trade back/out of the first round, either for vet help or because the player we want can be had later.

30% stand pat.

11% acquire a second 1st round pick (using future draft capital, the 2nd rounder and Bruno or as part of a trade for Gallo).

9% trade up

[Diesel]

Well Said Camp....  From the Players side.

But why would a team that is already stacked at SG and has other more pressing needs bring in SGs (that are expected to go around #20) to work out?

I realize that a lot of time teams bring in guys to work out with other guys and it's a great work of calendar synchronicity when it happens... but it feels like a big waste of time when we have guys in our top 15 and even a few guys on call who could play that position. 

[Diesel]

Just now, thecampster said:

Take this with a grain of salt but if I had to gauge what we're doing its likely broke down like this.

50% trade back/out of the first round, either for vet help or because the player we want can be had later.

30% stand pat.

11% acquire a second 1st round pick (using future draft capital, the 2nd rounder and Bruno or as part of a trade for Gallo).

9% trade up

I don't doubt your predictions here.   It's interesting because I was taken aback by a video I was watching on rumors for the draft... I can't recall the exact name.. but they mentioned that we were trying to move up in the draft. 

Originally, I scoffed... mainly because I don't believe that there is any right now talent in the draft and I don't believe that there is anybody in the draft that gives us better depth than we already have.  i.e. for Cap sake, I fall in with the 50% tradeback/out that you mention. 

But I do still give room for some insider to actually know something.   The fact that we brought in two SGs to workout hencefourth spoke some kind of trade to me.   Trade up... maybe not.. but I can see a trade for a vet  that will leave a fillable hole at the SG.  Maybe requiring Cam Move up and give us a need for a BU SG.

 

[thecampster]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Well Said Camp....  From the Players side.

But why would a team that is already stacked at SG and has other more pressing needs bring in SGs (that are expected to go around #20) to work out?

I realize that a lot of time teams bring in guys to work out with other guys and it's a great work of calendar synchronicity when it happens... but it feels like a big waste of time when we have guys in our top 15 and even a few guys on call who could play that position. 

Sorry I thought I was clear.

 

We bring in PG/SG/PF to look at. We bring in other PG/SG/PF to work out against them. We treat them all equal so we don't tip our hand.

Group 1 has a PG expected to go in the teens, a SG expected to go around 20 and a PF expected to go at the end of the 2nd round.

Group 2 has a PG expected to go in the 40's, a SG expected to go in the 40's and a PF expected to go in the teens.

Group 1 plays group 2 in 3v3's.  We're actually interested in all the players in Group 2. We're interested in the 40's for our second pick and the PF for the 1st.

We bring in the teens/20's players to measure our second rounders against good talent. We bring in the 2nd round PF as a stretch 4 because we have concerns how the teens PF might guard on the perimeter.

The 3 top level PG/SG aren't on our radar but they serve a purpose. To see if the 40's PG/SG can be coached up, handle better athletes, etc. 

 

they all take the visit for the reasons mentioned above. There are many examples of teams working out guys they have no interest in.  The best example of late is 

"

• On the Hawks not interviewing or working out Collins during the pre-draft process: "We saw him and scouted him a lot. We sent guys to the Pro Day in L.A. I saw him play three times this year. Probably four or five times last year. So we're comfortable with him."" https://www.peachtreehoops.com/2017/6/22/15858710/nba-draft-2017-john-collins-wake-forest-travis-schlenk-analysis

 

Everyone the Hawks worked out as a potential first rounder that year was because didn't want to tip their hand that Collins was their guy.  There were some they'd have taken if they fell to them but they were locked in on him months before draft night.

[Diesel]

Also...  OT.. Didn't want to start a new thread...

I was watching a Washington Wizards video today.  They were talking about the Wizards trading Beal and Westbrook for younger players and picks.

Here's the good part:

They said, "The Wizards ought to follow the Hawks Model where they traded all of the Allstar talent away and started over by trading up to get Trae Young and using picks to pick up all young guys to go with their rookie coach.".  

This made me smile and Shake my head at the same time.

 

There is a Hawks Model now.

[thecampster]

7 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I don't doubt your predictions here.   It's interesting because I was taken aback by a video I was watching on rumors for the draft... I can't recall the exact name.. but they mentioned that we were trying to move up in the draft. 

Originally, I scoffed... mainly because I don't believe that there is any right now talent in the draft and I don't believe that there is anybody in the draft that gives us better depth than we already have.  i.e. for Cap sake, I fall in with the 50% tradeback/out that you mention. 

But I do still give room for some insider to actually know something.   The fact that we brought in two SGs to workout hencefourth spoke some kind of trade to me.   Trade up... maybe not.. but I can see a trade for a vet  that will leave a fillable hole at the SG.  Maybe requiring Cam Move up and give us a need for a BU SG.

 

If we move anyone, I'm betting Huerter (though I doubt it....we have a year to make that decision).  K'Von's value is sky high right now and had he shown up against Milwaukee, NY, Chi, LA, Phi, Mia, Tor would have sold the farm to acquire him.

 

Teams not only see Kevin as a potential top 30 type of wing but one that can be had for no more than 1/2 of a max salary in 2 years. This isn't to say Kevin is the greatest player ever but that he's seen as extremely high value.

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Also...  OT.. Didn't want to start a new thread...

I was watching a Washington Wizards video today.  They were talking about the Wizards trading Beal and Westbrook for younger players and picks.

Here's the good part:

They said, "The Wizards ought to follow the Hawks Model where they traded all of the Allstar talent away and started over by trading up to get Trae Young and using picks to pick up all young guys to go with their rookie coach.".  

This made me smile and Shake my head at the same time.

 

There is a Hawks Model now.

IKR

[JayBirdHawk]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

Also...  OT.. Didn't want to start a new thread...

I was watching a Washington Wizards video today.  They were talking about the Wizards trading Beal and Westbrook for younger players and picks.

Here's the good part:

They said, "The Wizards ought to follow the Hawks Model where they traded all of the Allstar talent away and started over by trading up to get Trae Young and using picks to pick up all young guys to go with their rookie coach.".  

This made me smile and Shake my head at the same time.

 

There is a Hawks Model now.

Except we didn't trade them away...Al and Milsap left in FAcy for nothing in return. 

With the capspace, we took bad 1 year contracts for picks.

[Diesel]

Just now, thecampster said:

If we move anyone, I'm betting Huerter (though I doubt it....we have a year to make that decision).  K'Von's value is sky high right now and had he shown up against Milwaukee, NY, Chi, LA, Phi, Mia, Tor would have sold the farm to acquire him.

 

Teams not only see Kevin as a potential top 30 type of wing but one that can be had for no more than 1/2 of a max salary in 2 years. This isn't to say Kevin is the greatest player ever but that he's seen as extremely high value.

I thought the same thing.  I also won't be surprised if we trade Cam on draft night. 

I know Cam is a sacred cow here but his value is very high and his price tag very low.   It makes for a young fella trade...

I thought about those shooting Guards and said...

If we are antsy about JC (and I know we aren't)... we could get some insurance with either a 

Cam for Marvin Bagley   or Cam for JJJ deal.   He has the value to pull it off.  Those teams have draft spots where they may want to look at other bigs.  And if we're afraid of not being able to match then......

 

[Diesel]

7 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Except we didn't trade them away...Al and Milsap left in FAcy for nothing in return. 

With the capspace, we took bad 1 year contracts for picks.

Well, I didn't consider the Washington guy an expert on the Hawks.   I mean He did say we traded up for Trae. 

But his point (that was solid) is that with a rookie coach, Washington probably should trade Westbrook and Beal... and thought that our model was the one to follow.