My guy has talked around NBA circles of late

[DS5]

I seriously doubt Sac is offering Halliburton. The one thing they’re probably offering is taking Harris and I assume other teams are not.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, DS5 said:

I seriously doubt Sac is offering Halliburton. The one thing they’re probably offering is taking Harris and I assume other teams are not.

They are offering Haliburton. 

[REHawksFan]

5 minutes ago, thecampster said:

These orchestrated types of leaks are what teams use to see if there will be fan uproar if they trade certain players. It means they've been discussed in deals, but the team isn't sure what fan reaction will be. Its a public focus group if you will.

 

 

Hawks willing to engage in trade talks for John Collins, Bogdan Bogdanovic

39 mins ago – via Matt Moore @ Action Network

Two sources told Action Network Collins is a player the Hawks are willing to engage in talks about, along with Bogdan Bogdanovic.

 Top Rumors, Trade, Bogdan Bogdanovic, John Collins, Atlanta Hawks

Well, Travis, if you're reading this, if it brings back an all star like Simmons then hell yes, please trade JC and Bogie. 

 

Signed, some of the Squawk. 

[JayBirdHawk]

13 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

I'm going to say the unpopular thing and say that I actually wouldn't mind Harris.  I agree with everyone that he's WAY WAY overpaid, but as a player?  I think it would be interesting.  I'm of the opinion that Trae will make anyone better, so I would fully expect JC's production to go down if he is traded away and Harris' production would go up if he's playing with Trae and Simmons.  

Here's a deal that works salary-wise:

Philly gets:  JC, Bogie, Gallo, Delon

Hawks get:  Simmons, Harris

I have ZERO understanding how the CAP would work once Trae and Kev's new contracts kick in. So it may all be moot if it puts the team too far into the tax over the next few years.  But as far as players go, I wouldn't mind it.  

While Simmons was getting conditioned to play actual games, the lineup could look like this:

Trae / Wright

Kev / Lou

Hunter / TLC

Harris / OO

Capela / OO

And then once Simmons is ready to contribute, they could bring him in to play with Trae.

Trae / Wright

Kev / Lour

Hunter / TLC

Simmons / Harris

OO / Capela

 

And then in the offseason you trade Clint for another wing and sign another C to backup OO.

I think if they are trading JC for Simmons, they need to replace the shooting of JC and Simmons won't do that.  So at least Harris would do that to an extent.  

 

You included Delon Wright in your original proposal, but still have him in the active lineup.

Next year Simmons, Harris, Young, Hunter and Huerter are a combined $125 million add Clint that brings it to $144 million for 6 players.

[JayBirdHawk]

40 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I agree about fox.  But the thing that many outlets are saying is that Sactown would take Harris and Send Haliburton instead of fox.

This morning, there is talk of Fox to Indy for Sabonis.   The way that that happens is if Sac gets back Sabonis and McConnell (makes sense for Sac) or Sabonis and Holiday (which is what I can see )

Simmons + Sabonis?  I don't know why they wouldn't want Turner instead.  However, if they gut their Pgs....and Haliburton...Sactown could have their long range plans done. 

If Philly did get Haliburton, I want to see what they'd take for Curry. 

I think it should be the opposite - If Sac is taking Harris they should keep Haliburton and send Fox.  They'd have too much money in Fox, Harris and Simmons

[REHawksFan]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

You included Delon Wright in your original proposal, but still have him in the active lineup.

Next year Simmons, Harris, Young, Hunter and Huerter are a combined $125 million add Clint that brings it to $144 million for 6 players.

Yeah....I had to edit as I meant Dieng included in the trade, not Delon.  Although both seem to work for the trade machine.  

Is it possible to trade Clint for lesser incoming salary in the off season?  That would reduce the $144M for next year.  I'm assuming any trade for Simmons spells the exit for Clint this offseason so I'm not overly concerned about his specific salary.  Not sure how to trade him without taking back the same salary though.  

[JayBirdHawk]

2 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

Yeah....I had to edit as I meant Dieng included in the trade, not Delon.  Although both seem to work for the trade machine.  

Is it possible to trade Clint for lesser incoming salary in the off season?  That would reduce the $144M for next year.  I'm assuming any trade for Simmons spells the exit for Clint this offseason so I'm not overly concerned about his specific salary.  Not sure how to trade him without taking back the same salary though.  

Yes. To take back less salary they team you are trading him to has to have capspace to make up the difference.

[bleachkit]

18 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

If Sac is going to put all their eggs on Simmons/Sabonis then they deserve their fate 

What do they have to lose? They haven't made the playoffs in ages 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Diesel said:

The crazy part..

If we did trade enough to take back both Harris and Simmons...

Per Game Table

Rk	Player	Season	Age	G	GS	MP	FG	FGA	FG%	3P	3PA	3P%	2P	2PA	2P%	eFG%	FT	FTA	FT%	ORB	DRB	TRB	AST	STL	BLK	TOV	PF	PTS
1	John Collins	2021-22	24	38	38	32.4	6.4	12.0	.536	1.4	3.3	.435	5.0	8.8	.574	.595	2.9	3.7	.793	1.8	6.1	7.9	1.9	0.6	1.1	1.2	3.1	17.2
2	Tobias Harris	2021-22	29	34	34	34.8	6.9	15.1	.457	1.2	3.8	.313	5.7	11.3	.505	.496	3.1	3.7	.856	1.2	6.2	7.4	3.8	0.5	0.6	1.7	2.1	18.1

Data courtesy Stathead.com.

The question is how does Harris compare to JC?

 

 

Harris is a better passer and worse at everything else and 5 years older and way more expensive.  

Scoring - He takes 3.1 more shots per game and score 0.9 more points

Rebounding, Steals and Blocks - All in favor of JC (this season and past seasons)

Floor Spacing - 43% > 31% (i.e., in fairness to Harris he clearly is less of a threat when open on the perimeter but the gap is bigger than normal this season - more normal would be ~3% in JC's favor)

Note that the edge for JC grows on a per minute basis since Harris also plays 2.4 more minutes per game.  

 

So this all says nothing any of us didn't already know.  JC > Harris but both are quality players.  

[kg01]

Any way we can fleece the Selltics as they try to avoid the tax?

Maybe pick up Nesmith for cheap.  He's the only young player there that could still be ... something?  Has regressed under their new coach but showed flashes for Braaad.

Yeah, you read that right @marco102.  kg is touting a young guy who's not a Hawk.

Put that in yer pipe and smoke that crack.

[macdaddy]

35 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

What do they have to lose? They haven't made the playoffs in ages 

They'll lose 3-5 years and then be tanking to try to draft another fox and haliburton.   Not that i think those guys are great necessarily but not seeing Simmons and Sabonis doing anything. 

[marco102]

6 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Any way we can fleece the Selltics as they try to avoid the tax?

Maybe pick up Nesmith for cheap.  He's the only young player there that could still be ... something?  Has regressed under their new coach but showed flashes for Braaad.

Yeah, you read that right @marco102.  kg is touting a young guy who's not a Hawk.

Put that in yer pipe and smoke that crack.

Yeah of course you would.  A young player that doesn't contribute to winning and has little upside...lol.

[REHawksFan]

25 minutes ago, AHF said:

Harris is a better passer and worse at everything else and 5 years older and way more expensive.  

Scoring - He takes 3.1 more shots per game and score 0.9 more points

Rebounding, Steals and Blocks - All in favor of JC (this season and past seasons)

Floor Spacing - 43% > 31% (i.e., in fairness to Harris he clearly is less of a threat when open on the perimeter but the gap is bigger than normal this season - more normal would be ~3% in JC's favor)

Note that the edge for JC grows on a per minute basis since Harris also plays 2.4 more minutes per game.  

 

So this all says nothing any of us didn't already know.  JC > Harris but both are quality players.  

I don't think anyone would trade JC for TH, but if taking on TH is the only way to get Simmons, is BS + TH > JC + whatever else gets thrown in to make the deal work?  

I'm talking just on court as well.  I understand the contract may be completely prohibitive.  But if they could make the money work somehow, does the on court get better?  

[AHF]

1 minute ago, REHawksFan said:

I don't think anyone would trade JC for TH, but if taking on TH is the only way to get Simmons, is BS + TH > JC + whatever else gets thrown in to make the deal work?  

I'm talking just on court as well.  I understand the contract may be completely prohibitive.  But if they could make the money work somehow, does the on court get better?  

Seems to me the answer to that is more about what else we are giving to do the deal and how Simmons works out.  

[REHawksFan]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

Seems to me the answer to that is more about what else we are giving to do the deal and how Simmons works out.  

I would think the deal would be BS + TH for JC, Bogie, Gallo, and either Dieng or Delon.  

 

EDIT:  I would keep OO, Hunter, and Kevin with Trae, but that's just me.  

Edited January 19, 2022 by REHawksFan

[JeffS17]

1 hour ago, Sothron said:

I don't want to trade Collins unless it is necessary to get a superstar. I am wearing my Collins City edition jersey to the game tonight.

I feel this.  For basketball reasons I agree, but more importantly, im not trying to clean out my closet.... with Cam gone, if we also ship JC+Hunter i will only have trae jersey left lol

OO city jersey tonight for me, the yellow has grown on me a lot and hope he continues to ball.  You'll probably know it's me if you see that one because I think I'm the only person in Atlanta that special ordered OO17 jersey in yellow lol

[JeffS17]

44 minutes ago, AHF said:

Harris is a better passer and worse at everything else and 5 years older and way more expensive.  

Scoring - He takes 3.1 more shots per game and score 0.9 more points

Rebounding, Steals and Blocks - All in favor of JC (this season and past seasons)

Floor Spacing - 43% > 31% (i.e., in fairness to Harris he clearly is less of a threat when open on the perimeter but the gap is bigger than normal this season - more normal would be ~3% in JC's favor)

Note that the edge for JC grows on a per minute basis since Harris also plays 2.4 more minutes per game.  

 

So this all says nothing any of us didn't already know.  JC > Harris but both are quality players.  

It looks like you're comparing only this years stats but if you look at Tobi last year he looks like a very very good player: 20 PPG on basically 50/40/90.  And probably more importantly, he's not catching lobs and only shooting corner 3s to get his stats.  IMO he's a better and more well rounded player than JC.  JC is still on a much much better contract and I wouldn't want Harris on that contract but I think people here underrate him and probably overrate Collins.  If we do trade Collins, I'm interested to see what his production and efficiency looks like playing without Trae.

 

[Spud2nique]

@AHF I need a brinks trucks full of flowers  

For Fox  

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, Spud2nique said:

@AHF I need a brinks trucks full of flowers  

For Fox  

Hold on.. stop the trucks it could be Sabonis for Fox .. well this is humbling..

[Hawkmoor]

2 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

I'm going to say the unpopular thing and say that I actually wouldn't mind Harris after looking a little more into him and thinking about it.  I agree with everyone that he's WAY WAY overpaid, but as a player?  I think it would be interesting.  I'm of the opinion that Trae will make anyone better, so I would fully expect JC's production to go down if he is traded away and Harris' production would go up if he's playing with Trae and Simmons.  

 

I'm gonna give my opinion on two points you made.  First, I agree that Harris is a better player than he is given credit for.  He was one of the most feared players for me against the Hawks in the playoffs.  I don't know his contract situation, but if the Hawks can pay that can of loot to Bogi,  they can pay that kind of loot to Harris.  Obviously not both on the same roster, but you get the idea.  Next, I'm of the opinion that Trae Young does NOT make players around him better.  Its not a coincidence that he is in the top 10 in the NBA in usage.  The comment you made is WHY John Collins wants to bounce.  Yeah, John is gonna SAY the right things to the media, but the guy wants out and Trae would be happy to see him go.  Now, Trae COULD make those around him better.  He proves it every blue moon.  The way he helped close out Milwaukee recently is a example. Trae has the ability to make those around him better, he can Coop might be the best natural passers currently in the NBA,  but he has to cut back on his shooting drastically to make those around him better.

Edited January 19, 2022 by Hawkmoor