The cobbled together, stuff we held on to during the playoffs mega super rumor and team direction thread.

[Wretch]

22 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Mm-hmm, mmhmm, all that.

But, and I have to be the one to say it (again), you know the reality is ol' Zack is just using us as leverage to get the big deal from CHI right?  That's par for the course, sadly.

Dude listen...... I'm gonna keep dreaming all the way up until the ink dries lol Not only that, but I DID say in a "magical world" where it all comes together.

On a more tangible note, I've scrutinized every inch of his exit interview.   It is clear that Zach wants to get paid, while at the same time it's not immediately clear if he expects Chicago is willing to pay him.  If it's max money and mutual desire to keep him in Chicago, how exactly does "negotiation" figure into any of it?  By that same token, the concept of negotiations is a CLEAR indicator in the interview and in all the news surrounding the team.  I also don't know how much negotiation and leverage is necessary if we're tipping our hand that we've identified him as our primary target.

The way I see it, and f it's not about fit, and he's not really weighing his options financially... If Chicago is willing to pay him, he stays.  There's no speculation.  There's no plan to explain to him or negotiate, because they did all that last season and they had tremendous success.  If they DON'T want to give him max money and we do, he's gone in a SNT.

Seems to be speculation about his future from the CHI fans, in the rumor mill, from rumblings in our FO, and honestly all fueled by speculation from Zach himself.  IMHO...I think he's earned his money and I think we're willing to give it to him regardless of any posturing.  The last part of the article really has me raising my eyebrows:
 

Quote

But LaVine will take other factors into consideration too. As for what those factors are, exactly? He’s not sure yet.

“That’s a good question because  I don’t even know yet,” he said. “I think that’s something that I get to go home with my wife and my family and discuss. Make a pros and cons list, I don’t know. It’ll make me feel like I’m back in high school doing the Venn diagram. I don’t know. It’s something I haven’t thought about yet… That’s going to be a question I can answer later on this summer.”

I've listened to a lot of his interviews over the last couple of years.  He's not a LeBron or Kyrie type of interview dancer.  He's a straight shooter.  I think he's honestly weighing his options.

[sturt]

53 minutes ago, thecampster said:

When discussing deals like Gobert, Ayton, Simmons, Levine, etc....it isn't just about acquiring those players.  It isn't Gobert > Clint or Simmons > Huerter.  The Hawks need to ensure they are sending out enough contract to = the incoming player plus the cheap vet taking one of the outgoing players' spots.  You can't think of these deals as Gobert for Clint/Hunter because a vet bought out by his club is also coming here in that scenario for 2-5 million. Its Gobert + mystery vet chasing a ring.  If you upgrade Clint with Gobert/Ayton and bring in another star, pushing Huerter to the bench, you are telling the league you're serious about contending. Those older vets will try to latch on. We're going into the LT this year. The question is how much and for how many years. The ring chasing vets will only latch on.

While this is well-taken, and historically accurate, a key ingredient in the theory that we'll attract a higher caliber of minimum-contract vets is that our competitors for their services aren't more attractive, and typically, by virtue of the "been-there-done-that" premise... and until we get to an NBA Finals, I'm not sure we win that calculation.

But then too, it's negated even more by the money factor... it's really only when you're offering the same (nor nearly same) money that the previous question even becomes a question.

 

[sturt]

51 minutes ago, marco102 said:

wants the max.  Hawks would be happy to give it to him.

I'm less certain of this, me. It's early. A lot of talk. I'm skeptical.

[marco102]

20 minutes ago, sturt said:

I'm less certain of this, me. It's early. A lot of talk. I'm skeptical.

Ok

 

[JeffS17]

Whew, just got through many pages... sounds like most of the obvious targets are in discussion.  It will be interesting to see where we make a move.  I'd argue we should go the route of giving up the least amount of picks because we still need to see what we have with some of the younger guys.  We entered the offseason healthier than we have in the past 3-4 years, so I'm hoping we get a big leap from at least one of Hunter/OO and maybe even Kev/JC.  Also want to see what we have with Jalen before we go all-in on a trade target.  We need a few different things, so whatever is cheapest in draft capital is my vote for this offseason.  

[JayBirdHawk]

50 minutes ago, Wretch said:

Dude listen...... I'm gonna keep dreaming all the way up until the ink dries lol Not only that, but I DID say in a "magical world" where it all comes together.

On a more tangible note, I've scrutinized every inch of his exit interview.   It is clear that Zach wants to get paid, while at the same time it's not immediately clear if he expects Chicago is willing to pay him.  If it's max money and mutual desire to keep him in Chicago, how exactly does "negotiation" figure into any of it?  By that same token, the concept of negotiations is a CLEAR indicator in the interview and in all the news surrounding the team.  I also don't know how much negotiation and leverage is necessary if we're tipping our hand that we've identified him as our primary target.

The way I see it, and f it's not about fit, and he's not really weighing his options financially... If Chicago is willing to pay him, he stays.  There's no speculation.  There's no plan to explain to him or negotiate, because they did all that last season and they had tremendous success.  If they DON'T want to give him max money and we do, he's gone in a SNT.

Seems to be speculation about his future from the CHI fans, in the rumor mill, from rumblings in our FO, and honestly all fueled by speculation from Zach himself.  IMHO...I think he's earned his money and I think we're willing to give it to him regardless of any posturing.  The last part of the article really has me raising my eyebrows:
 

I've listened to a lot of his interviews over the last couple of years.  He's not a LeBron or Kyrie type of interview dancer.  He's a straight shooter.  I think he's honestly weighing his options.

Agents:

 

 

[marco102]

6 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Agents:

 

 

Certain media members really don't like Klutch.  Is it the LBJ effect? 

Edited May 25, 2022 by marco102

[Wretch]

45 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Agents:

 

 

I hear you loud and clear girl! lol

Let me be clear though.  I'm absolutely not saying there's drama. I'm kind of saying the opposite. I think no conversations should be taking place about Zach Lavine.  What is there to talk about?  To me, it would seem that him returning is a no-brainer....IF there were no questions about paying what he's worth and/or his actual interest in exploring the market.

I'm saying that there are indications of negotiation where there shouldn't be,  This is a whole conversation when trying to figure out what to pay a guy and/or if/how he fits into the plans.  IMO, I just don't see any questions that need answering in that.  

I'm also not trying to hype up any actual or perceived drama.  Sometimes I've done that, but the thought never entered my brain here.  Not until you shared this.  I'm just reading the exit interview, and admittedly I might read too much into it, but it seems like the door is open where it shouldn't be.  I think that, along with everything I'm reading, points to a guy who is going to give an honest look at his free agency and actually weigh his options.  Nothing about him or the situation says otherwise to me. 

That may change as we get closer to July, but for now...I'm good with what I'm reading.

[thecampster]

58 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Certain media members really don't like Klutch.  Is it the LBJ effect? 

Klutch is highly effective at getting their guys paid, branding them, getting them on teams they want.  Rubs old schoolers (rightly so) the wrong way.  Klutch is highly aggressive using sketchy tactics.  They follow the "anything goes" method. They leverage everyone....especially media.

[thecampster]

Okay, time for a humor break.

 

For all struggling to fill up the tank, you can still get gas at Taco Bell for $1.39.

 

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

Certain media members really don't like Klutch.  Is it the LBJ effect? 

Lebron Tampers... constantly.

[kg01]

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

Certain media members really don't like Klutch.  Is it the LBJ effect? 

Only certain agents can be super-agents.  Klutch guys don't fit the mold so the things they do, which are basically the same as any other power agent does, hit folks different.

[kg01]

40 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Klutch is highly effective at getting their guys paid, branding them, getting them on teams they want.  Rubs old schoolers (rightly so) the wrong way.  Klutch is highly aggressive using sketchy tactics.  They follow the "anything goes" method. They leverage everyone....especially media.

... and prominent board members too, I bet.

[theheroatl]

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2022/05/25/are-lavine-rumors-smoke-without-fire-report-says-teams-expect-him-to-re-sign-with-bulls/
 

This is the sort of blog post that the local beat writer posts before their hometown team gets jilted.

To be honest, if Atlanta isn’t appealing to Zach he would probably force something to L.A.

[bleachkit]

3 hours ago, theheroatl said:

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2022/05/25/are-lavine-rumors-smoke-without-fire-report-says-teams-expect-him-to-re-sign-with-bulls/
 

This is the sort of blog post that the local beat writer posts before their hometown team gets jilted.

To be honest, if Atlanta isn’t appealing to Zach he would probably force something to L.A.

Bulls can offer him the most money. There just isn't a lot the Hawks can do to really improve. Both Lavine and Ayton are long shots unfortunately.

[marco102]

2 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Bulls can offer him the most money. There just isn't a lot the Hawks can do to really improve. Both Lavine and Ayton are long shots unfortunately.

In a sign and trade, the Hawks can offer just as much as the Bulls.

[JayBirdHawk]

35 minutes ago, marco102 said:

In a sign and trade, the Hawks can offer just as much as the Bulls.

Bulls can offer a 5 year deal with 8% raises each year....in a SnT deal every other team is limited to a 4yr deal and 5% raises each year.

[marco102]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Bulls can offer a 5 year deal with 8% raises each year....in a SnT deal every other team is limited to a 4yr deal and 5% raises each year.

If that's the case, Zach is staying with the Bulls. I was for sure I read you could do a 5 year max and then trade the player.  

But alas I'm probably wrong.

Edit: I was wrong. 

 

Quote

As of the 2017 CBA, sign and trade contracts of five years are forbidden, since the player would not be allowed to sign outright for five years with his new team.

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by marco102

[marco102]

46 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Bulls can offer him the most money. There just isn't a lot the Hawks can do to really improve. Both Lavine and Ayton are long shots unfortunately.

I'm leaning with you on this now bleachy.

[JTB]

54 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Bulls can offer him the most money. There just isn't a lot the Hawks can do to really improve. Both Lavine and Ayton are long shots unfortunately.

 

7 minutes ago, marco102 said:

I'm leaning with you on this now bleachy.

Hate to say it but me too. Not to be negative but I’m more excited that that Schlenk is actually trying to improve the team in a big way….we just haven’t had many committed GMs go after big time moves.

As far as it getting done or not for these two (Lavine and Ayton) it would be great but I just don’t see it happening either which is very unfortunate.

 

I CAN see us getting Gobert however if that’s what Schlenk really wants to do. I definitely believe the Jazz will for sure take back Capela and Hunter just to get out of Goberts contract IF that’s the framework deal on the table. That’s a no brainer for Ainge…but for the Hawks I would hate that deal and would hate if it’s our big move of the summer. 
 

Lavine + Ayton : seems like long shots 

Gobert : he’s there if you really want him that is my belief and I don’t think it’s a long shot

 

I do like Gobert and I do see his value over Capela even though he’s just a longer version of capela TO me , his length can’t be taken for granted as it gives him a massive defensive edge that capela will never live up to even if he can do the same things defensively. You really can’t teach height and length.