The cobbled together, stuff we held on to during the playoffs mega super rumor and team direction thread.

[Hawkmoor]

10 minutes ago, AHF said:

Plays like this are a shameful commentary on the refs.  Either on their competency or on their integrity.  (Only other option is both.)

The NBA goes out of its way to make me not like its product.  To be honest, I barely watch the NBA anymore.  Outside of the Hawks,  the interest isn't there because I could see through their mess years ago.  Sports is SUPPOSE to be on the ups. Heck, I felt silly even writing that.  I still feel like the NBA front office controls where EVERY major player in the league goes.  They tell you to your face because its a fact the league office has TO APPROVE trades.   I'm not buying the Lebron as GM garbage.  The NBA doesn't have any love for the Hawks, thus, you never hear about any major players coming to the ATL.  Its that simple.

[thecampster]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

I do struggle a bit to understand why you complained so hard about the 23 year old playing at an All-NBA level but not the 24 year old who was playing at replacement level for much of the season.

Trae - Hunter

28.4 ppg > 13.4  ppg 

.603 ts% > .547 ts%

9.7 apg > 1.3 apg

3.7 rpg > 3.3 rpg (yes, that is the rebounding average)

0.9 spg >  0.7 spg

0.1 bpg < 0.4 bpg 

10.0 WS > 1.1 WS

5.2 BPM > -3.9 BPM (yes, negative)

4.8 VORP > -0.8 VORP (yes, negative)

3.7 RAPTOR > -2.1 RAPTOR (yes, negative)

 

For me, I'm over the moon with how well Trae has come along in his young career.  I saw a harsh downside when we drafted him and he has outperformed even what I would have considered a "realistic" ceiling projection for him at this point in career.  Definitely not complaining about him game after game.

Hunter has been considerably less than I had hoped for career to date but I actually share hope with you that he will continue to improve.  I don't expect he will be an All-Star by his 5th year but that would be amazing (with the comparison to Jaylen Brown).  

So I'm less perplexed by your uncritical support of Hunter as I am by your hyper critical breakdown of Trae.

I do agree with you that if we run the team back, we need to see a big step up from Hunter next season if this team is going to be as good as we all hope it will.  A healthy offseason for him, just like for OO and others, should be time well spent so he can best position himself for his next contract.

 

Would you be willing to run that same stat breakdown for Huerter, BB, JC, Clint (apologies for the big ask)?

 

[RandomFan]

5 hours ago, Diesel said:

Does Tucker play big men?  I saw him hounding Trae and I saw him hounding Tatum and I saw him hounding Holiday.. and I saw Max Struss playing the PFs...

I'm not moving the goal posts.  My point is that bigs are still in the East.   Bam is effective, but just like Last year's playoffs... when Miami was swept by Milwaukee in the first round... Bam can't do it alone. 

 

They were one Butler missed game winner from the finals, but ok...

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

3 hours ago, NBASupes said:

San Antonio – They are looking to make some minor moves. They want to improve their squad and add more vets. They been in contact with Atlanta about Bogi.              

What is SAS offering for Bogi? They have later picks 20 and 25.

[NBASupes]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

What is SAS offering for Bogi? They have later picks 20 and 25.

I do not have anything in terms of offers, just talks. 

[terrell]

4 hours ago, NBASupes said:

2022 NBA Draft Talk Plus Hawks/NBA Updates

Orlando – The talk around Orlando is that it’s a five-player race between Holmgren, Banchero, Smith, Ivey, and Daniels. Orlando hasn’t shown its hand to anyone so far. The assumption is that it will be Holmgren or Smith but it’s too early to say.

Oklahoma City – In the least shocker, OKC is highest on Jaden Ivey the most. This is what I was told and that there are executives in that organization who think Giddey, Ivey, and SGA can work long term. While many expected one of the bigs to be the pick, I am told that it’s looking more and more likely that it’s Ivey. People expect OKC and SAC to have talks but SAC has taken a hard line stance that they want to keep their 2023 1^st unless it’s lottery protected. This is being said by SAC contact as well as others around the league when speaking about SAC.

Houston – It’s pretty much looking like one of the 3 bigs here. His Houston contact couldn’t confirm the order but it’s basically one of them. Within the organization, they are questioning the fit of Ivey with Green.

Sacramento – Pretty much one of the bigs is their choice. There is talk of them potentially trading down. They have reached out to Atlanta about John Collins but I don’t have anything truly concrete to say it’s their top backup plan if the bigs are gone before 4. Just based on how OKC feels about Ivey, I doubt all three bigs will be gone by 4.

Detroit – Daniels is getting a lot of love here but so is Murray and Ivey. Mathurin, Williams and Duren are dark horses here for now.

Indiana – He hasn’t heard anything from IND in terms of the draft but they are openly willing to move Brogdon and Turner.

Portland – I am told they would prefer to have John Collins over Jerian Grant and would like O.G. Anunoby over JC but the cost for OG and JC is much higher than what they even think Grant will cost. They are not willing to trade #7 for Grant. They would rather trade a protected 1^st. I am told, OG not available and it would have to be an overpay. JC is not available either but it will cost Josh Hart and #7 overall. Portland is expected to keep the pick is what I was told.

NO  - I don’t have anything for the draft for them. Just they want to keep Zion and he’s not getting traded at all.  

San Antonio – They are looking to make some minor moves. They want to improve their squad and add more vets. They been in contact with Atlanta about Bogi.                

Washington – They have 15 players they really like and they are choosing between those top 15 guys. I don’t know who those guys are yet.

 

Atlanta News

Ayton, Gobert, Mitchell, LaVine, and Beal.

As for Ayton, I got his preference list. He wants to go to a team where he is highly featured and they have a winning team right now. He would prefer to stay in PHX.

Gobert – His ideal spot from his agent is Golden State. Utah isn’t too keen to keeping him in the West. Atlanta and Toronto are teams his agent likes a lot that’s been mentioned for him. Teams are looking for Atlanta to drop out the race like Boston for Kawhi Leonard to make the cost go much cheaper. Utah has eyes on OG but TOR is only interested in trading OG for Mitchell who has lots of admirers around the league.

Mitchell – He’s not available but everyone is watching what happens in Utah just in case he is. His agent has put out their teams he’s interested in but he wants to stay in Utah for the long term.

LaVine – The #1 available FA is leaning to returning as long as he can get the full max from CHI who’s been reluctant but like the Hawks with ISO Joe, might have their hands forced to do so. I am expecting Atlanta to make a serious run but he's likely to return. He wants to see which team has the best presentation but teams around the league think it's for show if CHI shows him the money. 

Beal – It’s nearly a done deal, he’s going to get the supermax to return to WAS.

 

What will Atlanta do? I do not know. I do know that Ayton and Gobert have a great shot of coming to Atlanta. Higher than any other time we wanted someone since ISO Joe. It’s going to be hard to upgrade that SG spot. All of the same level players as what we have right now are available but no one of a super high tier is available for trade and the ones we covet seem to be slipping away. I am not expecting to trade up in the draft either. I think Portland makes the most sense for that and they aren’t the biggest fans of the price tag for the vets on the market. We will see…

I do expect Atlanta to remain extremely active as that’s the mandate that’s out there around the league from teams who’s talked to Atlanta about moves. The big thing is Atlanta isn’t Brooklyn with Billy King with it. Teams don’t know if they are trading players for assets or trading for studs. It seems like they are willing to do both. Depending on the said asset.

So you think we might just run it back again but with Ayton or Gobert instead of Capela? Playin here we come.. smh

[JTB]

That last update from @NBASupes is discouraging but I came to terms long ago that Ayton and Gobert are our best shots to make any major improvement this off season and the most realistic options as far as top targets whether that intrigues our fans or not.

Hopefully Trae understands the market too and does his part as the star of this team. He need to understand who’s truly available and help push like he has before shall he see it as a great opportunity for this team.
 

im done stating the impact Ayton would bring but based on his wants Ayton would definitely be used more here with a star Point who loves to pass and would no doubt get way more offensive opportunities here as he could become the primary scoring option here something he won’t do with the Suns based on their scheme. I believe trae will take a backseat to the scoring as long as the team is winning but if he feels he has to go and drop points then he does that. Trae has not had an opportunity to play with another guy who can truly go and get their own bucket at will.

2nd Ayton says winning matters to him. Well I know with Ayton we will win but I do not know what winning means to Ayton necessarily. If he comes here are we guaranteed 55 wins per season and a top seed???…no one can truly answer that really depends on the build out of the roster.

 

 

as far as a SG upgrade I knew the SG position would be tough to truly upgrade but that’s why I suggested that we should be going after Bruce Brown and just put a good defender / decent spot up shooter next to Trae who’s extremely committed to defensive side.

If you can add Ayton to Trae, Hunter, Collins then Bruce Brown can easily fit in as this is more than enough offense to be a problem for majority of the nba.

[Spud2nique]

2 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

The NBA is a clown show.

Agreed. I tried and stop to think if I was biased cuz I love the Hawks and hate the Warriors and thought, nope, Adam Silver gettin that Silicon Valley . Dirty dirty Sliver.

 

Obviously gonna continue watching Hawks next year but maaaaan, that’s not right.

[warcore]

42 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

What is SAS offering for Bogi? They have later picks 20 and 25.

I'll gladly take either of those for Mr. Bogus. 

[macdaddy]

Isn't this always the way.   No one easily gives up difference making talent.   This is why when there were rumors about Mitchell wanting out I thought we'd be fools to pass.   CJ would have been a huge improvement for us.  Lavine would be an improvement but he isn't going anywhere.   On the rare occasions you can find someone with elite skills being dumped you take it unless it's going to handicap you. 

[kg01]

1 hour ago, thecampster said:

Would you be willing to run that same stat breakdown for Huerter, BB, JC, Clint (apologies for the big ask)?

 

Bro, never complain about a big as.... oh, never mind you said 'ask'.

[NBASupes]

11 minutes ago, terrell said:

So you think we might just run it back again but with Ayton or Gobert instead of Capela? Playin here we come.. smh

Maybe without JC either. And Gallo. Possibly Bogi... get the drift... 

[NBASupes]

12 minutes ago, JTB said:

That last update from @NBASupes is discouraging but I came to terms long ago that Ayton and Gobert are our best shots to make any major improvement this off season and the most realistic options as far as top targets whether that intrigues our fans or not.

Hopefully Trae understands the market too and does his part as the star of this team. He need to understand who’s truly available and help push like he has before shall he see it as a great opportunity for this team.
 

im done stating the impact Ayton would bring but based on his wants Ayton would definitely be used more here with a star Point who loves to pass and would no doubt get way more offensive opportunities here as he could become the primary scoring option here something he won’t do with the Suns based on their scheme. I believe trae will take a backseat to the scoring as long as the team is winning but if he feels he has to go and drop points then he does that. Trae has not had an opportunity to play with another guy who can truly go and get their own bucket at will.

2nd Ayton says winning matters to him. Well I know with Ayton we will win but I do not know what winning means to Ayton necessarily. If he comes here are we guaranteed 55 wins per season and a top seed???…no one can truly answer that really depends on the build out of the roster.

 

 

as far as a SG upgrade I knew the SG position would be tough to truly upgrade but that’s why I suggested that we should be going after Bruce Brown and just put a good defender / decent spot up shooter next to Trae who’s extremely committed to defensive side.

If you can add Ayton to Trae, Hunter, Collins then Bruce Brown can easily fit in as this is more than enough offense to be a problem for majority of the nba.

Its going to be tough. As you said. Maybe the FA market and the MLE market is our best bet. 

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, thecampster said:

Would you be willing to run that same stat breakdown for Huerter, BB, JC, Clint (apologies for the big ask)?

 

before we get to the big ask..

For Trae to be outrebounding Hunter is damn crazy..

I would almost beat Money that Jalen Williams could come in here and from day 1, compete for the starting SF position.  Not to mention JJ. 

 

[theheroatl]

I get the feeling every rumor up to this point is from agents. It seems that the actual trades and signings will be way off from early speculation. My head is spinning with half the nba “showing interest” or will pursue so and so free agent.

I remember when the Celtics went to Durants entourage vacation in the Hamptons… my head was spinning and I thought the Celtics had it in the bag.

 

what I do know is these players are fickle as hell and change their mind on a feeling at the last moment.

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, theheroatl said:

what I do know is these players are fickle as hell and change their mind on a feeling at the last moment.

I don't know about that statement. Some of these players are cemented in their stances.  Ben Simmons for example.. He was going to sit out the whole season if necessary...  there was no fickle.  And his motive may be to get to Atlanta or Bust.  If so, Lebron and company are giving him all the marching orders. 

Agents play a really big role in where a player goes. 

That's why I would not be surprised to see us with Simmons and Bledsoe by July 4th. 

 

 

[theheroatl]

4 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I don't know about that statement. Some of these players are cemented in their stances.  Ben Simmons for example.. He was going to sit out the whole season if necessary...  there was no fickle.  And his motive may be to get to Atlanta or Bust.  If so, Lebron and company are giving him all the marching orders. 

Agents play a really big role in where a player goes. 

That's why I would not be surprised to see us with Simmons and Bledsoe by July 4th. 

 

 

I don’t believe any of that rumor. Sorry Diesel.

Too much of a tampering risk based on the fundamentals of that rumor and Travis is known to be a straight shooter.

Edited June 6, 2022 by theheroatl

[Diesel]

8 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

I don’t believe any of that rumor. Sorry Diesel.

Too much of a tampering risk based on the fundamentals of that rumor and Travis is known to be a straight shooter.

I don't know about tampering.   The rumor is that we're trading Bogi for the 7th pick in the draft.  basically. 

That's a very clear trade.. no tampering. 

The other part is that a player's agent has stated that his player would love playing with the Hawks. 

Most agents try to do what they can to get a player to a situation that they like.  No tampering there.

Tampering is Lebron acting as GM and building a team while wining and dining players that he wants to play with. 

 

 

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

Bogi for the 7th pick in the draft. 

Hmm, so we trading a vet for a rookie here? I’m surprised Bogi is worth the 7th around the league, personally I think he’s awesome but I thought they say Bogi for #14. 7 isn’t bad at all I just don’t wanna go young anymore.