Post-Moratorium Insider Rumor Thread

[Final_quest]

11 hours ago, AHF said:

Strange because Bogi was better off the bench than starting.  Lol

Your explanation tracks but it is a huge gap in %.

You have to understand the context.  A healthy Bogdanovic hit more threes in a month than any Hawk ever as a starter, he holds that record.  I don't understand his injury, but he seemed to heal a bit last year around the time he went into the bench role.  

Capela also played through some limitations last year and starting feeling better around April.  Healthy Clint and Bogi is where I see the most correlation to our winning % in the past two years.  Did you know our record with Bogi was 30-14 in the 2021-2022 season? 

His knee is a real mystery to me.  He can't play like the unstoppable Bogi as a starter, but he can lead the league in bench scoring with suspect defense.  It's gonna be interesting to see what he produces on the court next year.  

[AHF]

11 hours ago, LucastheThird said:

We all know Kevin Huerter coming off the bench was not a recipe for success, he needs to start and we just don't have that opportunity for him anymore. 

If the "win condition" for Huerter playing well was being on the floor with Trae because Trae would get him open looks, then I'm not sure this was a real problem for us anymore.  If you assume that Nate will stagger Trae and Murray so that we have very few minutes without one of them on the floor then you could make a case that the "win condition" of either Trae or Murray being on the floor would be in effect for Huerter's minutes whether he started or came off the bench.  So I'm not sure that we are looking at situation where Huerter would play minutes in anything other than a "win condition" scenario.  

The obvious issue to me is less about Huerter not being able to start but more about us not having enough minutes for Murray, Bogi, Huerter, and Hunter at the 2/3 positions.  If we had kept everyone and Bogi went down with injury, though, I would not see a problem with Kevin being successful on this roster as I think he would always be playing off the opportunities created by Trae or DM.

[macdaddy]

Man i'm seeing some weird takes on Huerter

- there weren't enough minutes for him?  Who cares and i guarantee there would be plenty over the course of the season

- he's no good off the bench?  he showed last year that he's a weak starting 2.   If he can't play off the bench then his career is in trouble.  But i actually think he'd be really good off the bench.  When he was coming off the bench last year our team was playing like trash all the way around.  

Bottom line I'd rather have Kev as our 4th guard than Holiday.  But I hope i'm proved wrong. 

[Sothron]

6 hours ago, JTB said:

Makes complete sense. I would have rather kept huerter strictly due to age and health over Bogi but Bogi is better suited to actually be a true sixth man. Hope bogi can stay healthy this season. He tends to get hurt in the first half of the season then have healthy second half seasons since he’s been a hawk anyways.

 

Moving on @Sothron….while I have your attention. I’m looking at the rumors that the heat may actually move forward with pursuing Durant from the Nets and of course Bam would be included in such a deal but I recall it was stated Bam and Simmons not being able to be on the same team due to one of the CBA rules with their contract extensions. This isn’t new info that hasn’t been discussed here but perhaps the 3rd teams who’d be involved to take on Simmons is new. Suns I’d imagine are no longer in picture since resigning Ayton and Jazz look like they’ve bought into Ainges full tank mode.

Im just curious at this point if the hawks are still one of the teams in a deal being discussed with nets and heat ? And if not who are the other teams ?

 

Trae and Ben want to play together and both are Klutch guys. It would not shock me at all to see the Hawks trade for Ben and move him to PF. That being said it would create spacing nightmares because would  have two non shooters on the court in starter roles in Ben and Capela and frankly Murray at a 33% 3 point shooter isn't going to scare anyone either.

The defense would be lockdown tight though and the fast break with Ben, Murray and Trae would literally fly down the court after every rebound or turnover. 

The last I heard the Nets know that Ben is seen as damaged good and his trade value is at its lowest. While I think the Hawks could stomach swapping out contracts to take on Ben we simply don't have the extra firsts that we used to have before the Murray trade. The Nets don't want to give up on Ben without him actually playing for them and want him to play to increase any potential trade value.

[cam1218]

1 hour ago, macdaddy said:

Man i'm seeing some weird takes on Huerter

Bottom line I'd rather have Kev as our 4th guard than Holiday.  But I hope i'm proved wrong. 

I think the problem is Holliday is fine being the 4th guard and Huerter/Bogi would not thrive or be happy in that role. They’d basically be competing or seeing who was healthy to be the third guard. 

[kg01]

8 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Trae and Ben want to play together and both are Klutch guys. It would not shock me at all to see the Hawks trade for Ben and move him to PF. That being said it would create spacing nightmares because would  have two non shooters on the court in starter roles in Ben and Capela and frankly Murray at a 33% 3 point shooter isn't going to scare anyone either.

The defense would be lockdown tight though and the fast break with Ben, Murray and Trae would literally fly down the court after every rebound or turnover. 

The last I heard the Nets know that Ben is seen as damaged good and his trade value is at its lowest. While I think the Hawks could stomach swapping out contracts to take on Ben we simply don't have the extra firsts that we used to have before the Murray trade. The Nets don't want to give up on Ben without him actually playing for them and want him to play to increase any potential trade value.

So you're tellin' me there's a chance ......

And BOS had a buncha non-shooters and rode the D and timely playmakin' all the way to the Finals, so folks can miss me with all the 'poor spacing' talk.

To be clear, that snark wasn't directed at you specifically.  Not that I'm afraid to douse you with a dose of it, just aiming that one more at a few others who've got their heads up the 'analytics' butt too far.

[LucastheThird]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

The obvious issue to me is less about Huerter not being able to start but more about us not having enough minutes for Murray, Bogi, Huerter, and Hunter at the 2/3 positions.  If we had kept everyone and Bogi went down with injury, though, I would not see a problem with Kevin being successful on this roster as I think he would always be playing off the opportunities created by Trae or DM.

That is all true, but I don't like to think about our players going down with injury. Even one who has been injured in every season with us. 

[macdaddy]

16 minutes ago, cam1218 said:

I think the problem is Holliday is fine being the 4th guard and Huerter/Bogi would not thrive or be happy in that role. They’d basically be competing or seeing who was healthy to be the third guard. 

Isn't that what you want?  Guys competing for playing time.  

[AHF]

3 minutes ago, LucastheThird said:

That is all true, but I don't like to think about our players going down with injury. Even one who has been injured in every season with us. 

I think we should expect we will have guys go down with injury and that people like Bogi and Hunter are high risk to miss material time among our wings.

[hawkman]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

I think we should expect we will have guys go down with injury and that people like Bogi and Hunter are high risk to miss material time among our wings.

That's why I still don't like the Huerter trade. Bogi, Hunter, and even AJ all have serious injury history. Having Huerter as a safety net at the 2/3 spots would make me feel a lot better. 

[cam1218]

11 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Isn't that what you want?  Guys competing for playing time.  

I hear you and I do, but they are established players who would not be happy as the 4th guard. I don’t want that unhappiness in the locker room. The competing for playing time usually works better with young players. 

[LucastheThird]

11 minutes ago, AHF said:

I think we should expect we will have guys go down with injury and that people like Bogi and Hunter are high risk to miss material time among our wings.

I understand the thinking, but would Kevin really be ok with his minutes dropping by 1/3 to 20 a game at best, while waiting for Bogi or Deandre to have an injury? Then going back to only 20 minutes a game once they were back healthy? 

 

Kevin is the ultimate team guy, but I don't know how he would react to that being his new normal. 

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, LucastheThird said:

I understand the thinking, but would Kevin really be ok with his minutes dropping by 1/3 to 20 a game at best, while waiting for Bogi or Deandre to have an injury? Then going back to only 20 minutes a game once they were back healthy? 

 

Kevin is the ultimate team guy, but I don't know how he would react to that being his new normal. 

I'm not getting this at all.  This is the friggin NBA.  You aren't guaranteed anything and it's not like Kev has 10 years in the league.   He's 4 years in and a career 11 point scorer and we're worried it will hurt his feelings to have to compete for minutes?

[Spud2nique]

51 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Trae and Ben want to play together

Does Trae realize that Ben doesn’t love the sport like he does.

[Spud2nique]

40 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Not that I'm afraid to douse you with a dose of it,

[LucastheThird]

3 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I'm not getting this at all.  This is the friggin NBA.  You aren't guaranteed anything and it's not like Kev has 10 years in the league.   He's 4 years in and a career 11 point scorer and we're worried it will hurt his feelings to have to compete for minutes?

Locker room issues are a thing and Cam almost ruined the chemistry last season before he was traded. 

 

https://www.sportstalkatl.com/hawks-report-cam-reddish-wanted-out-of-atlanta-months-ago/

 

Easiest way to turn a happy player into a malcontent is to cut their minutes that they feel they deserve/have earned. 

[AHF]

39 minutes ago, LucastheThird said:

I understand the thinking, but would Kevin really be ok with his minutes dropping by 1/3 to 20 a game at best, while waiting for Bogi or Deandre to have an injury? Then going back to only 20 minutes a game once they were back healthy? 

 

Kevin is the ultimate team guy, but I don't know how he would react to that being his new normal. 

I agree that the minutes crunch when people are healthy was the obvious issue once we acquired DM.  The same question could also be asked of Justin Holiday given that he has averaged almost 30 minutes per game over the last 5 years.

[macdaddy]

30 minutes ago, LucastheThird said:

Locker room issues are a thing and Cam almost ruined the chemistry last season before he was traded. 

 

https://www.sportstalkatl.com/hawks-report-cam-reddish-wanted-out-of-atlanta-months-ago/

 

Easiest way to turn a happy player into a malcontent is to cut their minutes that they feel they deserve/have earned. 

What exactly has he done to deserve anything?   And I say this as a guy who wanted to keep him. 

[Spud2nique]

14 minutes ago, AHF said:

The same question could also be asked of Justin Holiday given that he has averaged almost 30 minutes per game over the last 5 years.

Ya when I saw the minutes given to him, I couldn’t go through with an avatar bet. Ain’t no way Nate gives Griff 30 min a night, or 25, or 20.

[TRW]

I will forever be a fan of Kevin Huerter but we had to be realistic. We couldn't keep him and Bogi after the trade for Dejounte Murray. We can't be paying the 4th guard in our rotation over 15 million a year. Although it hurts, I believe trading Red Velvet for Holiday, Harkless, and a protected 1st just made too much financial sense. I also believe a healthy Bogi is an extraordinary offensive player, an upgrade over Red Velvet and decent defensive player.