2023-24 Insider Information Thread

[benhillboy]

It’s quite rare to see a “smallish” guard lead a #3 tournament seeded team in offensive and defensive rating by a wide margin like Sheppard did.  Super-high floor indicator like Haliburton’s metrics and scouting, which in turn pushes the ceiling as high as the player and surrounding fits want to and can take it, respectively.

His adjustment time to the physicality shouldn’t take too long either.  I had no idea son was jacked the f&@k up

 

He’ll be 200 pounds in no time, perfect PG size if you want to be able to press and finish.

Edited May 27 by benhillboy

[Threezus]

1 hour ago, Hawkish said:

DJ and OO are too much for KAT.  His contract diminishes his value to me.  

A more agile Mark Price was exactly my thought, too.

Yeah the contract is honestly my biggest issue with KAT.  If he was more of a DJ or a little more contract that didn't balloon so much i wouldn't hesitate to give some extra pieces for him.  As said im still a big KAT fan and have wanted him on the Hawks for awhile now to pair with Trae.  But if we do trade for him we need to be sensible about it and as much as i liked King Kongwu last year he really took a step back this year and has me worried.    I don't know if he is sulking because Capela kept the starting job and he wants it now or if he is just struggling to fit quinns scheme and stuff.  But he for sure looked worse this year im just not sure what caused it.

[Sothron]

46 minutes ago, benhillboy said:

It’s quite rare to see a “smallish” guard lead a #3 tournament seeded team in offensive and defensive rating by a wide margin like Sheppard did.  Super-high floor indicator like Haliburton’s metrics and scouting, which in turn pushes the ceiling as high as the player and surrounding fits want to and can take it, respectively.

His adjustment time to the physicality shouldn’t take too long either.  I had no idea son was jacked the f&@k up

 

He’ll be 200 pounds in no time, perfect PG size if you want to be able to press and finish.

The fact he had the BEST vertical in the entire combine at 43 inches is insane. He is a great athlete to go with his shooting, IQ and hands. If we really blew things up and drafted him I would be totally fine with it.

[AHF]

4 hours ago, Sothron said:

The fact he had the BEST vertical in the entire combine at 43 inches is insane. He is a great athlete to go with his shooting, IQ and hands. If we really blew things up and drafted him I would be totally fine with it.

It isn’t at all surprising to me.  His dad had a huge vertical as well.  People should not confuse that with him being an athlete like some other high rise point guards because his quickness is not near the same level as his vertical and I think quickness is more important.  His value doesn’t tie very much to the vertical.  It is the other things you mention: his shooting, his anticipation, and his solid play on both ends.  I think he is going to be good and that his floor is very high but I’m less optimistic on him being a superstar.  
 

On whether we trade both DJM and Trae, I don’t think that makes sense.  I think it should be expected that you will lose whatever trade you make with them.  Losing two trades like that only makes sense to me if we are going to tank and we don’t control our picks for the next 3 years.  This is not the time to raze the roster and start over.  We are a roughly .500 team that can improve from better fit and the #1 pick.  That makes so much more sense to me.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

19 hours ago, Hawkish said:

I have zero interest in KAT watching him look lost and average in the playoffs.  

Don't let a bad playoff series fool you.   He was damn good in the Phoenix and Denver series as the #2 guy.  He's having a nightmare series against Dallas.

KAT is still the type of upgrade frontcourt talent that this team could use.  I'd much rather bring in KAT, than sign Brandon Ingram to a similar deal.  And Minnesota could definitely use another PG like DJ, who can get his shot off in isolation, along with Ant-Man.

 

 

Atlanta gets its star frontcourt player

Minnesota gets its star PG to play with Ant and the ability to shed Wiseman's contract ( if they can do this )

Detroit gets value for trading Wiseman in the form of Hunter and Capela

 

Minnesota:  (PG) - Murray . . (G) Edwards . . (F) McDaniels . . (PF) Reid . . (C) Gobert

Detroit:  (PG) - Cunningham . . (G) Ivey . . (F) Hunter . . (PF) Stewart . . (C) Duren . . . . (6th man) Capela

Atlanta:  (PG) - Young . . (G) Bogi . . (F) Johnson . . (PF) Okongwu/#1 pick . . (C) KAT

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Don't let a bad playoff series fool you.   He was damn good in the Phoenix and Denver series as the #2 guy.  He's having a nightmare series against Dallas.

KAT is still the type of upgrade frontcourt talent that this team could use.  I'd much rather bring in KAT, than sign Brandon Ingram to a similar deal.  And Minnesota could definitely use another PG like DJ, who can get his shot off in isolation, along with Ant-Man.

 

 

Atlanta gets its star frontcourt player

Minnesota gets its star PG to play with Ant and the ability to shed Wiseman's contract ( if they can do this )

Detroit gets value for trading Wiseman in the form of Hunter and Capela

 

Minnesota:  (PG) - Murray . . (G) Edwards . . (F) McDaniels . . (PF) Reid . . (C) Gobert

Detroit:  (PG) - Cunningham . . (G) Ivey . . (F) Hunter . . (PF) Stewart . . (C) Duren . . . . (6th man) Capela

Atlanta:  (PG) - Young . . (G) Bogi . . (F) Johnson . . (PF) Okongwu/#1 pick . . (C) KAT

 

 

Honestly, KAT struggling in a big series may cause A-Rod and the Minnesota ownership to "blink".   Let's hope they blink.

The biggest way the Hawks could add talent to their team, is for another team to fall "out of love" with one of their better players.  That's probably what is happening with Ingram.  And I hope that's what happens with Minnesota and KAT.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

13 hours ago, AHF said:

Don’t attack.  Report if someone is attacking you.  There has been some cleanup on this thread.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

8 hours ago, Hawkish said:

We better not help them by taking KAT or Gobert off their payroll. 

They can keep Gobert. Give us KAT.

He's had a horrible playoff series, but he was good in the first 2 series.

[JeffS17]

I'm not sure if I'd rather have KAT or Ingram at this point-- neither feel like the piece we need and both feel overpaid for what they are.  And neither really give confidence they are winning players... 

I'd rather have Gobert than KAT, a take which dates back to a couple years ago but I still think holds.

[kg01]

Just now, TheNorthCydeRises said:

They can keep Gobert. Give us KAT.

He's had a horrible playoff series, but he was good in the first 2 series.

If we're being honest though, based on his overall playoff history, the good games could be outliers.  The stinkers could be his norm.

At high $40-mil/year?  Eh ..... 

[JeffS17]

3 minutes ago, kg01 said:

At high $40-mil/year?  Eh ..... 

He's gonna be at $50-60M when his extension kicks in next year 

[kg01]

1 minute ago, JeffS17 said:

He's gonna be at $50-60M when his extension kicks in next year 

Elizabet', I'm comin' ta join ya!

I just morphed into Fred Sanford when I read that.

Who wanna pay ol' 7-foot JJ Reddick that?  To disappear in the playoffs?

He'd be out at the 3pt line lookin at Trae like, "Bro, you gon go get some rebounds or nah?"

Shiiiii, atleast with Ingram there's a chance you could get him for less than the overpay.  Towns is auto-overpay from day 0. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

10 minutes ago, kg01 said:

If we're being honest though, based on his overall playoff history, the good games could be outliers.  The stinkers could be his norm.

At high $40-mil/year?  Eh ..... 

 

KAT at high 40M

or Capela + Hunter at mid 40M?

[JeffS17]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

KAT at high 40M

or Capela + Hunter at mid 40M?

Problem with this comparison is we're about to be off Capelas bad salary next year... Hunter is only 15% of the cap space and still useful, even if he never hit the ceiling we wanted him to hit.  He's not a good contract but not terrible either.  KAT, though, is locked in until through 2027 with a PO through 2028.  Not only is he underwhelming as hell in the playoffs, I don't trust that shaved meniscus for another 3 years of supermax money

[kg01]

3 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

KAT at high 40M

or Capela + Hunter at mid 40M?

1. Apparently it'd be Towns at high $50M's (yikes).

2. Those aren't the only 2 possibilities.  

[Hawkish]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

KAT at high 40M

or Capela + Hunter at mid 40M?

The suggestions people have posted include DJ.  Also, Capela expires after this year.  Hunter showed some life towards the end of the season.  I don’t see why KAT would be any better for us than he is showing for Minnesota.  Edwards gets the most attention.

 

[kg01]

1 minute ago, JeffS17 said:

Problem with this comparison is we're about to be off Capelas bad salary next year... Hunter is only 15% of the cap space and still useful, even if he never hit the ceiling we wanted him to hit.  He's not a good contract but not terrible either.  KAT, though, is locked in until through 2027 with a PO through 2028.  Not only is he underwhelming as hell in the playoffs, I don't trust that shaved meniscus for another 3 years of supermax money

I didn't even think of this.  IIUC, the fact that he opted for the procedure he had greatly increases the likelihood of shortening his career.  At the time, folks said it was worth it since this was MIN's most likely title season.  Wonder what 'they' think now. 

[JeffS17]

Just now, kg01 said:

I didn't even think of this.  IIUC, the fact that he opted for the procedure he had greatly increases the likelihood of shortening his career.  At the time, folks said it was worth it since this was MIN's most likely title season.  Wonder what 'they' think now. 

Yep, I honestly feel bad for KAT and for Minny fans alike, but mostly KAT-- Minny fans still have Anthony Edwards who should be easy to build around going forward.  KAT should have never opted for that procedure but I don't know the details of his case, sometimes that's the only option.  I actually like KAT personally and think he's a decent dude, just don't want him and his $60M salary hitting our payroll

[JayBirdHawk]

20 hours ago, Jody23 said:

This stuff is so disingenuous.  These teams want to get Trae for literally pennies on the dollar.

NOP flooding the market is all.

The Pelicans and Cavaliers are expected to re-engage on trade talks this offseason centered around Darius Garland, per

@cclark_13

(https://nola.com/sports/pelicans/why-pelicans-should-target-a-guard-in-any-ingram-trade/article_bdb01b7c-1aa3-11ef-8499-e3c24bd8b915.html…). If Donovan Mitchell ends up staying in Cleveland, swapping Garland for Brandon Ingram makes a ton of sense for both sides.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

8 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

He's gonna be at $50-60M when his extension kicks in next year 

If it makes you feel just a tiny bit better, his cap hit % goes down, despite the salary going up