2023-24 Insider Information Thread

[JeffS17]

42 minutes ago, KB21 said:

If Trae had walked up the court and asked out of the game the way Luka did last night, he’d be getting crucified by the media today.  

Yep, not that it's a realistic scenario anyways. Trae played on a twisted ankle in the bucks series...  You can criticize his game but his passion to play and be on the court every minute is unquestioned

[AHF]

37 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you because this statement doesn't coexist with this:

So which is it? Is Quin changing his shot selection or is he taking too many middys? 

I think Quin changes his shot diet and BIs size is the biggest difference in him not being the fit problem with Trae that DJM is. 

Let me use an analogy because there are no conflicts there.

My grandfather is a diabetic.  He eats sugar all the time and it is very unhealthy for him.  I expect once he starts working with Quin that he will eat less sugar but I'm concerned he will still eat too much sugar and that it will continue to be a problem because the core change has to come from him and not his coach.  So while I expect that he will improve, I am concerned he will keep eating more sugar than he should and not be his best self.

On the size part, I agree that this is a big deal and an improvement over DJM as far as fit as the SG (although I'm not sold he will be able to defend SGs regularly but that is a lesser concern if Jones is at the wing with him since I think Jones will end up with the tougher assignment between the 2 and the 3).

[AHF]

22 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

A lot of questions about if Sarr can even play center.  For all the crap Capela gets, he was our best defender and best rebounder last year by the numbers.  We're going to improve our defense by starting Okongwu and having Sarr/Bruno as backups?  Also, passing on Herb Jones to protect the potential of Sarr?  Analysts are calling the talent in this draft flat for a reason.  You guys are giving up a lot for the Sarr hype machine.  

Is there a single person here who doesn't want Herb Jones to pair with Sarr?  I may have missed it.

[kg01]

53 minutes ago, KB21 said:

If Trae had walked up the court and asked out of the game the way Luka did last night, he’d be getting crucified by the media today.  

Wait, what happened?  I tuned out that whole series since I couldn't get the meteor to win. 

[AHF]

Just now, kg01 said:

Wait, what happened?  I tuned out that whole series since I couldn't get the meteor to win. 

I haven't given up on the meteor.  

[REHawksFan]

54 minutes ago, KB21 said:

If Trae had walked up the court and asked out of the game the way Luka did last night, he’d be getting crucified by the media today.  

It's also curious to me how Trae gets killed on this board and in general for whining to the refs and complaining a lot while Luka gets a pass to literally throw his hands up and whine every single time he doesn't hit a shot.  And most of the times when he does hit the shot.  

[macdaddy]

Just now, REHawksFan said:

It's also curious to me how Trae gets killed on this board and in general for whining to the refs and complaining a lot while Luka gets a pass to literally throw his hands up and whine every single time he doesn't hit a shot.  And most of the times when he does hit the shot.  

Luka and Tatum are both big whiners. 

[Final_quest]

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

Is there a single person here who doesn't want Herb Jones to pair with Sarr?  I may have missed it.

If we can do both, I am much more inclined to go that route.  I don't think NO is gonna throw Herb Jones in the deal if all we give up is Capela, Hunter, and Murray.  That seems like what the FO might be trying to negotiate, but it doesn't sound like NO is gonna bite on that offer.  Therefore a trade down in this draft is pretty necessary to get an extra pick to make the deal work.  

[supermariowest]

I’m not familiar enough — if we add both Jones and Ingram, does one come off the bench? Or does one start at SG?

While we’re at it, let’s bring back Delon Wright and swing a trade for Caruso. Then add a Millsap/Carroll type PF — the lunch pail archetype. Does RoCo still have anything left in the tank?

[Afro]

4 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

It's also curious to me how Trae gets killed on this board and in general for whining to the refs and complaining a lot while Luka gets a pass to literally throw his hands up and whine every single time he doesn't hit a shot.  And most of the times when he does hit the shot.  

I must have had blinders on all season because I had no idea Lively was SO whiny. 

Dude is a rookie. Got away with at least 10 fouls in the 3rd alone, and was STILL acting like a spoiled child to the refs. 

Edited June 7 by Afro

[AtLaS]

4 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

It's also curious to me how Trae gets killed on this board and in general for whining to the refs and complaining a lot while Luka gets a pass to literally throw his hands up and whine every single time he doesn't hit a shot.  And most of the times when he does hit the shot.  

Winning cures everything.  Everything is a problem when you lose.  Start winning and most complaints will go away, Trae will be a perennial all-star, make all-NBA teams, etc.  

[bird_dirt]

3 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

If we can do both, I am much more inclined to go that route.  I don't think NO is gonna throw Herb Jones in the deal if all we give up is Capela, Hunter, and Murray.  That seems like what the FO might be trying to negotiate, but it doesn't sound like NO is gonna bite on that offer.  Therefore a trade down in this draft is pretty necessary to get an extra pick to make the deal work.  

I may be mistaken, but I don’t think it’s reliant on us giving up the 1 (to trade down for 4&8 and sending 8 to NOPe is what I’m guessing you’re alluding to). 

If a pick is necessary, we still have the Sac pick in our back pocket. 

[Hawkmoor]

2 hours ago, thecampster said:

If Trae was the only moving piece, I would buy this.  But he wasn't. There were other injuries before Feb 24th that played a role and there was the insistence to stick with Bey who was giving up 3's at an alarming rate.  On court/off court is a slightly better measure.

As a Trae Stan, my opinion is biased, I'll grant but some folks noticed some chinks in my Trae armor last year. I've got a real problem with how much whining he does, how much jawing with the referees and I think that does cost us some games.

There was a real difference in foul calling (eye test) after he went out last year. We started getting the benefit of the whistle and Dre started complaining less about it. Not trying to bag on Trae. My biggest issue with him is not his play or arguing if he makes an impact. My biggest issue now is the giant contract. We need to be getting superstar value when we toss out superstar contracts.

Fair analysis.  A lot of folks, coaches, refs and players who don't like Trae's game would more overlook it if not for the whining and complaining.  The biggest issue is him literally quitting during games when things don't go his way and he starts making "sarcastic" passes to his teammates, etc.  Again, its a fair analysis which points out why even the most diehard Trae fans like yourself sometimes find it hard to take up for him.

[AtLaS]

5 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

If we can do both, I am much more inclined to go that route.  I don't think NO is gonna throw Herb Jones in the deal if all we give up is Capela, Hunter, and Murray.  That seems like what the FO might be trying to negotiate, but it doesn't sound like NO is gonna bite on that offer.  Therefore a trade down in this draft is pretty necessary to get an extra pick to make the deal work.  

Giving up a potential all-star (Murray) on a great contract plus trading out of a potential superstar at #1 for a defensive role player in Jones?  And Ingram?   I LOVE Jones, but he is at best the 4th/5th best player on a championship team.  

You don't EVER give up #1 overall (even in a perceived "weak" draft) for a role player unless you think that role player wins you the championship.  

I'd consider throwing in the Sac pick, but definitely not #1 overall.  We already gave up Luka, Pau, missed on Chris Paul/Deron Williams/Brandon Roy.  Now we are going to trade the top pick for Herb?  Nah

[Hawkmoor]

7 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

Assist king overall the last half decade in the entire league. 
 

He wants nothing but to assist his teammates, literally and figuratively.

Trae's assists are skewed by his "usage" rate.  By default he is gonna have a high number of assists.  To show you that I'm not arbitrarily just piling on Trae, I believe he could still be the best pure assist point guard in the league regardless if he wanted to be.  I'm just saying that the way he plays the games currently, assists included, doesn't translate into the Hawks being a championship contending team.  Their win/ loss and playoffs records prove that. 

As you know, point guards are the qb of the offense.  Like football qbs it doesn't matter how good your physical tools are if the neck and up isn't correct.  Thats Trae's problem.  Fantastic skillset but from the neck/up dude is a selfish whiner who wants everything to be about him and not particularly the team.

Edited June 7 by Hawkmoor

[Hawkmoor]

7 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

right here.

 

[AHF]

15 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

Trae's assists are skewed by his "usage" rate. 

There is definitely a relationship between usage and assists but I wouldn't short change Trae.

By way of comparison from this season:

Kyrie Irving 28.1% Usage Rate, 23.8% Assist Rate

Trae Young 30.5% Usage Rate, 45.1% Assist Rate

[Spud2nique]

9 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

 

I can’t hear you the band is singing and I’m dancing  

[JTB]

43 minutes ago, supermariowest said:

I’m not familiar enough — if we add both Jones and Ingram, does one come off the bench? Or does one start at SG?

While we’re at it, let’s bring back Delon Wright and swing a trade for Caruso. Then add a Millsap/Carroll type PF — the lunch pail archetype. Does RoCo still have anything left in the tank?

Ingram and Herb would both start if that trade went down.

Starters would be…

Trae

Ingram

Herb

Jalen

Clingan or Sarr at center is my guest.

[Hawkmoor]

16 minutes ago, AHF said:

There is definitely a relationship between usage and assists but I wouldn't short change Trae.

By way of comparison from this season:

Kyrie Irving 28.1% Usage Rate, 23.8% Assist Rate

Trae Young 30.5% Usage Rate, 45.1% Assist Rate

Big difference is Kyrie is not the full time point guard in Dallas.  Luka Doncic is.