2023-24 Insider Information Thread

[bleachkit]

5 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Who do we take at 4 assuming Sarr,Clingan and Risacher are gone?

Sheppard. There's no substitute for great shooting. Plus his defense is solid. Look there are no sure things in this draft, at least his projection is based on skill. 

[kg01]

5 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Sheppard. There's no substitute for great shooting. Plus his defense is solid. Look there are no sure things in this draft, at least his projection is based on skill. 

Why not just sign Jordan Clarkson or trade Trae for Cole Anthony?

[KB21]

8 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Sheppard. There's no substitute for great shooting. Plus his defense is solid. Look there are no sure things in this draft, at least his projection is based on skill. 

The two guys Quin will want the most at the top of this draft are Clingan and Sheppard.  

[AHF]

How does Sheppard fit?  He can't play with Trae or DJM or Bufkin for any real length of time because any of them with Sheppard is too small of a backcourt just like Trae and DJM.  

Let's look at the most likely scenario where Trae is still here and DJM is traded.

Trae 35 mpg - 13 minutes without Trae

How many minutes are there for Sheppard in this scenario?  How many for Bufkin?  I don't think it is a lot.

Let's assume you can find matchups where playing Trae and one of them isn't a terrible mismatch ala the garbage numbers from Trae / DJM lineups for say 10 minutes per game.

That leaves 23 minutes to be shared by Sheppard and Bufkin at max.

How does that make sense as a rotation in the short-term or long-term?  Sheppard isn't going to get any bigger.  Sheppard is 6'1.75'' with a 6'3.25'' wingspan.

[txsting]

46 minutes ago, Packfill said:

I agree that the testing did him no favors, and for that reason I would not take him #1 even in this draft.  That said, I do think he is a guy that could step in day one and be a rotation wing (he would not be a starter on the Hawks absent significant trades this off-season, but he could be a top 8 rotation player).  The Hawks could absolutely use a player like this.  I just don't think he will ever be more than a supporting player.

I am still on the Sarr train at #1 (though I don't love him as a prospect), but I think he will have a longer development path than the other options (meaning Clingan and Risacher) and will likely not offer much in year one. The tradeoff obviously is his upside long term.  Difficult needle for the Hawks to thread given the impact of the Murray trade.

I really hope the Hawks make some significant changes this off-season, starting with trading Murray for a better fitting piece.  If it means taking a step back initially in order to take two steps forward later so be it.

The fact that they aren't leaking Sarr makes me think they are trying to squeeze somebody.  I think the Risacher stuff is primarily designed to squeeze SA.  Still have a hard time believing the pick could ever be anybody except Sarr, if we pick at #1.

[KB21]

Here's what I'm thinking with Reed.  Quin loves guys who can shoot, and Reed is the best shooter in this draft by a significant margin.  Quin also has a recent history of fielding top 10 offenses and defenses with two shorter guards in Mike Conley and Donovan Mitchell.  Now, those guys had better wingspans and could play bigger because of that, but I don't think Quin is going to be as concerned about that as you would think.  

[Afro]

3 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Here's what I'm thinking with Reed.  Quin loves guys who can shoot, and Reed is the best shooter in this draft by a significant margin.  Quin also has a recent history of fielding top 10 offenses and defenses with two shorter guards in Mike Conley and Donovan Mitchell.  Now, those guys had better wingspans and could play bigger because of that, but I don't think Quin is going to be as concerned about that as you would think.  

Look, we can do worse than the Quinn Jazz teams.....but completely recreating a roster that got no further than the conference semis(even with 2 stars) is concerning me lol. 

[Hawkish]

10 minutes ago, Afro said:

Look, we can do worse than the Quinn Jazz teams.....but completely recreating a roster that got no further than the conference semis(even with 2 stars) is concerning me lol. 

I had the exact thought.  One would think the Jazz roster makeup would be what Quin would avoid due to the ceiling you referenced.  Having said that, those teams didn’t have a JJ.  No third guy on that level… the depth on their team was more developed, role-based.  JJ, Bufkin, OO, Gueye, etc., may have more upside than anything he had further down the roster.  Not disagreeing with you, just a point to consider…

[Afro]

8 minutes ago, Hawkish said:

I had the exact thought.  One would think the Jazz roster makeup would be what Quin would avoid due to the ceiling you referenced.  Having said that, those teams didn’t have a JJ.  No third guy on that level… the depth on their team was more developed, role-based.  JJ, Bufkin, OO, Gueye, etc., may have more upside than anything he had further down the roster.  Not disagreeing with you, just a point to consider…

Oh I'm not trying to say they will be exactly like the Jazz, but you are selling the talent of that team a bit short. 

They obviously had Gobert and Mitchell. But also Bojan who averaged 18ish per on 40% 3pt shooting for 3 years. Clarkson and Ingles who finished 1st and 2nd in 6MOY. 

Their role players were verrryyyy good back then. Idk if we can realistically project our 4th-8th guys to be that good. Certainly not *better* than that. 

Edited June 19 by Afro

[AtLaS]

15 hours ago, AHF said:

Two quick comments:

How can you take a wing at 1 who is a disaster with his athleticism?  Seeing 5th percentile stuff from him really limits his potential.  I can’t justify a wing as the top pick when he tests worse than Edey on athletic measures.  (Relative to others at the position.)
 

Who cares how Clingan shoots against chairs and 6’0’’ managers in workouts?  Does anyone believe that is more predictive than his free throw shooting?  What is his excuse for why he can’t shoot from the line in games?  (The reasons to take him have nothing to do with his shooting.)

Requoting here for emphasis.  There's just no argument IMO for anyone other than Sarr.  Definitely not Risacher, he just has potential bust written all over him.

I GUESS i could see an argument for Clingan, as he will be a solid center if he can stay healthy, but he will never be star player.  And drafting him means Trae will always have a paint clogging 5.  We need a floor spacer who can also play D and catch lobs.   Clingan will be schemed out in the playoffs, and he can't shoot free throws which is a huge handicap in close games.  Someone like Al Horford is a matchup NIGHTMARE for Clingan, like he just wouldn't be able to guard Horford or Max Klieber even at 39 years old.  Teams know this.

[Hawkish]

1 minute ago, Afro said:

Oh I'm not trying to say they will be exactly like the Jazz, but you are selling the talent of that team a bit short. 

They obviously had Gobert and Mitchell. But also Bojan who averaged 18ish per on 40% 3pt shooting for 3 years. Clarkson and Ingles who finished 1st and 2nd in 6MOY. 

Their role players were verrryyyy good back then. Idk if we can realistically project our 4th-8th guys to be that good. Certainly not *better* than that. 

I agree that they grew into productive players as they embraced their role.  Our Bogi is comparable to theirs.  Bufkin has Clarkson+ upside.  They did not have an Okongwu-level big outside Gobert (that I recall).  I’m just saying the the ceiling of our players may be a bit higher while their floors are currently below what the Jazz players became.  Interesting projection — I don’t think Ingles did much once he left Utah.  

[Mikey]

On 6/7/2024 at 6:03 PM, Mikey said:

Unless Tony goes rogue and forces the players hand I can say without a doubt the Hawks will not be selecting Sarr with the number 1 pick. He has made it clear to all the teams picking at the top that he would like to play for the Wizards 

the pick will either be Risacher or clingan with the ideal outcome a trade back 

 I posted this on JUNE 7th. I told you all before anybody. Not supes, not sothron, not woj, not givony, not KOC, not anybody. My source is directly in the hawks building. And told you guys 12 days ago what was happening and it was met with “you are just pushing an agenda”. Or “we will take him anyways who cares” 

[JayBirdHawk]

On 6/9/2024 at 3:31 PM, Mikey said:

Sarr has already worked out with the hawks once. And I can tell you now… rule out edey. It’s not happening

Here. You are correct in not saying a 2nd workout.

That honor falls to @Sothron

On 6/9/2024 at 5:59 PM, Sothron said:

I wasn't supposed to say this but since Mikey has...we've already had one workout with Sarr and another is going to happen. I'm still hearing it is Risacher and Clingan/Sarr after. 

@NBASupes

[parfait]

1 hour ago, macdaddy said:

Who do we take at 4 assuming Sarr,Clingan and Risacher are gone?

Then you could do the original trade-up mentioned by @Sothron, sending AJ to Houston to move from #4 to #3, and still secure Clingan.

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, parfait said:

Then you could do the original trade-up mentioned by @Sothron, sending AJ to Houston to move from #4 to #3, and still secure Clingan.

If Houston doesn’t get a better bid.

[macdaddy]

Here's what i can figure out from the information provided that seems reliable.  Does everyone agree this is what's happening?

1. We will try to trade down to obtain another asset and still draft Clingan

2. If we can't trade down then we will just draft Clingan #1

One wild card is if we take say Risacher/Sarr #1 with the intention of flipping him for Clingan at #4 (or 3) then there is a possibility, maybe small, that someone takes Clingan in front of us and we keep our pick.  

Is anyone other than Clingan really a possibility for us barring someone monkey wrenching. 

[AHF]

Just now, macdaddy said:

Here's what i can figure out from the information provided that seems reliable.  Does everyone agree this is what's happening?

1. We will try to trade down to obtain another asset and still draft Clingan

2. If we can't trade down then we will just draft Clingan #1

One wild card is if we take say Risacher/Sarr #1 with the intention of flipping him for Clingan at #4 (or 3) then there is a possibility, maybe small, that someone takes Clingan in front of us and we keep our pick.  

Is anyone other than Clingan really a possibility for us barring someone monkey wrenching. 

I would just say generally that I don’t put that much confidence in the media reports given the misinformation teams put out.

[JayBirdHawk]

2 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Here's what i can figure out from the information provided that seems reliable.  Does everyone agree this is what's happening?

1. We will try to trade down to obtain another asset and still draft Clingan

2. If we can't trade down then we will just draft Clingan #1

One wild card is if we take say Risacher/Sarr #1 with the intention of flipping him for Clingan at #4 (or 3) then there is a possibility, maybe small, that someone takes Clingan in front of us and we keep our pick.  

Is anyone other than Clingan really a possibility for us barring someone monkey wrenching. 

There is too much noise for any one thing to be true.

Couple years ago, the Magic was expected to draft Smith, Thunder draft Paolo and Rockets draft Chet  It ended up being:

1. Magic draft Paolo Banchero (Duke)

2. Thunder draft Chet Holmgren (Gonzaga)

3. Rockets draft Jabari Smith (Auburn)

 

......and the biggest thing was that the Magic didn't even work out Paolo.

[macdaddy]

Yeah but if you look at the info we have here about Clingan and the verified reports about his workout it seems to add up.   Most of the fans outside of the Squawk still think we're taking Sarr but none of the actual info that we have says that.   

There has to be pressure to do something this summer.  I'm ready for the chips to start falling. 

[Final_quest]

46 minutes ago, Mikey said:

 I posted this on JUNE 7th. I told you all before anybody. Not supes, not sothron, not woj, not givony, not KOC, not anybody. My source is directly in the hawks building. And told you guys 12 days ago what was happening and it was met with “you are just pushing an agenda”. Or “we will take him anyways who cares” 

Sarr quickly turned into a sacred cow.