I've been watching the 2024 NBA Draft class and it's been... weaker than usual

[NBASupes]

19 minutes ago, marco102 said:

This is where I disagree with you. You put bust in every post with Sarr.  Just talk about why you don't like him. You don't have to say bust.  Like if you literally say, I don't think Sarr can do this and this or he'll never do this.  People will support it. It's the projection of bust without defining what you think a bust is. 

A bust to me is literally someone who doesn't get the team option picked up on in the third year of a rookie contract. Is that what you think Sarr will be? 

I am addressing a specific post. That's not my vested logical take on him. This is just an opinion. This is not the same. 

Saying he will be a bust - opinion 

Saying I would take him 15-20 - opinion

Analysis about Sarr - report. 

You can't use my opinions to remove from my reports

As far as Edey, just read my scouting reports. If you do, it would be clear why I believe he would be a perennial MVP candidate with the Hawks. 

Edited May 26 by NBASupes

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, TRW said:

I think Sarr is our best option also. Nothing against these other guys but I think some people forget that Sarr is playing in one of the best basketball leagues in the world. Averaging around 9 pts and 5 rebs a game in 17 minutes of action. In a league that isn't kind to young players. He dominated that G-League team and more than likely would have put up better numbers than Edey and Clingan in college. But at the end of the day I'm an Atlanta Hawks enthusiasts first and I'll root for whoever we choose. One day soon Sarr and Mo Gueye might be our future.

There is nothing wrong with you think in your opinion, you prefer Sarr. Nothing is wrong with that. Even me, I've said it's clear who has the highest ceiling in this class and it's Sarr in my report. 

I really wish folks would stop acting like I am a hater because I don't see this the way you do.

[marco102]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I am addressing a specific post. That's not my vested logical take on him. This is just an opinion. This is not the same. 

Saying he will be a bust - opinion 

Saying I would take him 15-20 - opinion

Analysis about Sarr - report. 

You can't use my opinions to remove from my reports

What? Everything on here is opinion. If I say something, on here, I can't get mad when you say I said it. 

Also what is your definition of bust?

Edited May 26 by marco102

[NBASupes]

Just now, marco102 said:

What? Everything on here is opinion. If I say something, on here, I can't get mad when you say I said it. 

You respond too fast. I didn't even have time to edit.

[bleachkit]

These things are hard to predict. There were endless arguments about Ayton, Bagley and JJJ. Little did the board know at the time that a generational talent fell right into our lap, only to be traded away. 

Edited May 26 by bleachkit

[marco102]

8 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

There is nothing wrong with you think in your opinion, you prefer Sarr. Nothing is wrong with that. Even me, I've said it's clear who has the highest ceiling in this class and it's Sarr in my report. 

I really wish folks would stop acting like I am a hater because I don't see this the way you do.

Let's say between 10% - 50% of my post on Edey or Clinghan had the word bust in them.  What would you call me?  An objective draft analyst or a hater.  The language used in posts, reports, opinions, elicit responses received.  I'm not calling you hater just explaining why someone may say that.

Edited May 26 by marco102

[TRW]

Supes I don't see you as a hater. I see you as a passionate enthusiasts who thinks out of the box. A enthusiasts who loves doing his own homework/research on prospects.

[marco102]

1 minute ago, bleachkit said:

These things are hard to predict. There were endless arguments about Ayton, Bagley and JJJ. Little did the board know at the time that a generational talent fell right into our lap, only to be traded away. 

get some new material. 

[bleachkit]

Just now, marco102 said:

get some new material. 

My point is these things are extremely difficult to predict. 

[KB21]

Don’t believe any talk that Sarr wouldn’t go any higher than 10th in most drafts.  If the Spurs had gotten the first pick, we’d be hearing nothing but how great the combo of Wemby and Sarr will be.   They would be calling them the Eiffel Towers.  

[Eddielives]

I'm starting to hope that we trade the #1.  If we could somehow take advantage of some overzealousness for Sarr and come out of this draft with Clingan and Risacher, we'd be much better off in the long run  

[Threezus]

12 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Don’t believe any talk that Sarr wouldn’t go any higher than 10th in most drafts.  If the Spurs had gotten the first pick, we’d be hearing nothing but how great the combo of Wemby and Sarr will be.   They would be calling them the Eiffel Towers.  

Their is something i have always been a little confused by when people praise Wemby so much coming out but knock on Saar.  In both of their 1st full years in very similar leagues.   LNB Pro and the NBL which are pretty close in level on a international scale for talent and skill.  I would say they are both in the 7 to 10 range as far as leagues go. 

They had very similar numbers across the board

Saar
17 min  9.2 ppg  4.4 rebounds 0.9 assists   1.3 blocks  0.5 steals  then %'s of   71% FT   60.5%  from 2  and 30% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.1 TO and 1.4 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min  20.3 ppg  9.2 rebounds  1.8 assists  2.8 blocks  1 steal    same %'s    2.3 TO  and 2.9 foul

Now for Wemby in his 1st main year in a similar league
18.4 min  9.4 ppg  5.1 rebounds  0.8 assists 1.8 blocks  0.9 steals   Then %'s of  70% FT 60.5% from 2 and 26% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.8 TO  2.5 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min 18.4 ppg  10 rebounds 1.5 assists  3.5 blocks 1.7 steals  same %'s   3.5 TO  and 4.9 fouls

They are VERY VERY SIMILAR in their 1st years at the same age in a similar league. 

Where Wemby really took his big step and became the 1st overall generational type player is in year 2 in that league at age 19/20.  Saar won't get a year 2 with more minutes and experience to try to match wemby's numbers.  Because Saar's year 2 will be in the nba. 

Wemby's year 2 numbers where he took a massive step is

32.1 min   21.6 PPG  10.4 rebounds  2.4 assists   3 blocks 0.7 steals   with %'s of  82.8 FT  56% from 2 and 27.5% from 3   2.6 TO's and 2.0 PF.

This is not to say wemby isn't a better player or prospect coming out as i think he is but it's also for me meant to show saar until the same age was on the same exact trajectory putting up equivalent to wemby on the court.       Saar's athleticism and handles for his size are very very good and he has elite level defense and able to guard multiple positions as well.

I sorta feel bad for Saar because i think everyone sees wemby from last year as a god tier prospect and Saar who is a little step down from wemby not being able to live up to his level.  But then by doing that they completely drop him like 5 tiers down compared to wemby and at the same age and level of play he isn't that far off lol.     Saar is a much better prospect to me than alot of people are giving him credit for and his ceiling is absurdly high. 

I also know stats aren't everything but i have watched both of them play and saar isn't that far off from what wemby showed at that same age and experience level.

[KB21]

29 minutes ago, Threezus said:

Their is something i have always been a little confused by when people praise Wemby so much coming out but knock on Saar.  In both of their 1st full years in very similar leagues.   LNB Pro and the NBL which are pretty close in level on a international scale for talent and skill.  I would say they are both in the 7 to 10 range as far as leagues go. 

They had very similar numbers across the board

Saar
17 min  9.2 ppg  4.4 rebounds 0.9 assists   1.3 blocks  0.5 steals  then %'s of   71% FT   60.5%  from 2  and 30% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.1 TO and 1.4 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min  20.3 ppg  9.2 rebounds  1.8 assists  2.8 blocks  1 steal    same %'s    2.3 TO  and 2.9 foul

Now for Wemby in his 1st main year in a similar league
18.4 min  9.4 ppg  5.1 rebounds  0.8 assists 1.8 blocks  0.9 steals   Then %'s of  70% FT 60.5% from 2 and 26% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.8 TO  2.5 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min 18.4 ppg  10 rebounds 1.5 assists  3.5 blocks 1.7 steals  same %'s   3.5 TO  and 4.9 fouls

They are VERY VERY SIMILAR in their 1st years at the same age in a similar league. 

Where Wemby really took his big step and became the 1st overall generational type player is in year 2 in that league at age 19/20.  Saar won't get a year 2 with more minutes and experience to try to match wemby's numbers.  Because Saar's year 2 will be in the nba. 

Wemby's year 2 numbers where he took a massive step is

32.1 min   21.6 PPG  10.4 rebounds  2.4 assists   3 blocks 0.7 steals   with %'s of  82.8 FT  56% from 2 and 27.5% from 3   2.6 TO's and 2.0 PF.

This is not to say wemby isn't a better player or prospect coming out as i think he is but it's also for me meant to show saar until the same age was on the same exact trajectory putting up equivalent to wemby on the court.       Saar's athleticism and handles for his size are very very good and he has elite level defense and able to guard multiple positions as well.

I sorta feel bad for Saar because i think everyone sees wemby from last year as a god tier prospect and Saar who is a little step down from wemby not being able to live up to his level.  But then by doing that they completely drop him like 5 tiers down compared to wemby and at the same age and level of play he isn't that far off lol.     Saar is a much better prospect to me than alot of people are giving him credit for and his ceiling is absurdly high. 

I also know stats aren't everything but i have watched both of them play and saar isn't that far off from what wemby showed at that same age and experience level.

Yep.  Sarr hasn’t had the hype machine pushing him from the time he was a 15 year old either.  

[NBASupes]

40 minutes ago, Threezus said:

Their is something i have always been a little confused by when people praise Wemby so much coming out but knock on Saar.  In both of their 1st full years in very similar leagues.   LNB Pro and the NBL which are pretty close in level on a international scale for talent and skill.  I would say they are both in the 7 to 10 range as far as leagues go. 

They had very similar numbers across the board

Saar
17 min  9.2 ppg  4.4 rebounds 0.9 assists   1.3 blocks  0.5 steals  then %'s of   71% FT   60.5%  from 2  and 30% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.1 TO and 1.4 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min  20.3 ppg  9.2 rebounds  1.8 assists  2.8 blocks  1 steal    same %'s    2.3 TO  and 2.9 foul

Now for Wemby in his 1st main year in a similar league
18.4 min  9.4 ppg  5.1 rebounds  0.8 assists 1.8 blocks  0.9 steals   Then %'s of  70% FT 60.5% from 2 and 26% from 3 at the age of 18/19.
1.8 TO  2.5 fouls

The per 36 on that is
36 min 18.4 ppg  10 rebounds 1.5 assists  3.5 blocks 1.7 steals  same %'s   3.5 TO  and 4.9 fouls

They are VERY VERY SIMILAR in their 1st years at the same age in a similar league. 

Where Wemby really took his big step and became the 1st overall generational type player is in year 2 in that league at age 19/20.  Saar won't get a year 2 with more minutes and experience to try to match wemby's numbers.  Because Saar's year 2 will be in the nba. 

Wemby's year 2 numbers where he took a massive step is

32.1 min   21.6 PPG  10.4 rebounds  2.4 assists   3 blocks 0.7 steals   with %'s of  82.8 FT  56% from 2 and 27.5% from 3   2.6 TO's and 2.0 PF.

This is not to say wemby isn't a better player or prospect coming out as i think he is but it's also for me meant to show saar until the same age was on the same exact trajectory putting up equivalent to wemby on the court.       Saar's athleticism and handles for his size are very very good and he has elite level defense and able to guard multiple positions as well.

I sorta feel bad for Saar because i think everyone sees wemby from last year as a god tier prospect and Saar who is a little step down from wemby not being able to live up to his level.  But then by doing that they completely drop him like 5 tiers down compared to wemby and at the same age and level of play he isn't that far off lol.     Saar is a much better prospect to me than alot of people are giving him credit for and his ceiling is absurdly high. 

I also know stats aren't everything but i have watched both of them play and saar isn't that far off from what wemby showed at that same age and experience level.

Seriously. They are the same exact age right now as prospects and 17 year old Wemby was on a Euroleague team against tougher Comp in a more difficult role than he was as a 18 year old. 

I get called a hater but ya'll do what I did with Cam Reddish. Just went straight to a comp that made more sense and tried to use that as a reasoning. I am probably gonna be called a hater for pointing out the obvious like usual.

If we judge Sarr OTE stats at 17, it's not good. His Australian stats at 18, not good. But I am the hater. Supes, you just mad, you are hating, you don't want him and that's why you are down on him

https://overtimeelite.com/players/65c5906d-2aed-4c1c-9a11-8fc7a6ba6068

 

Edited May 26 by NBASupes

[KB21]

[NBASupes]

6 minutes ago, KB21 said:

I pray this comes true. 4 and 8  

[Threezus]

43 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Seriously. They are the same exact age right now as prospects and 17 year old Wemby was on a Euroleague team against tougher Comp in a more difficult role than he was as a 18 year old. 

I get called a hater but ya'll do what I did with Cam Reddish. Just went straight to a comp that made more sense and tried to use that as a reasoning. I am probably gonna be called a hater for pointing out the obvious like usual.

If we judge Sarr OTE stats at 17, it's not good. His Australian stats at 18, not good. But I am the hater. Supes, you just mad, you are hating, you don't want him and that's why you are down on him

https://overtimeelite.com/players/65c5906d-2aed-4c1c-9a11-8fc7a6ba6068

 

1st off i didn't call you a hater nor did i talk bad about any of the guys you have liked as like quite a few of them as well.  2nd off since you forgot i was right there with you on the Cam Reddish train and crucified a bit as well.  Considering i am a Duke fan and i have literally asked for most players coming from there over the years on this board which is why im so bullish on jalen johnson right now even over moving trae and murray before i would move him.       Also his Australian stats at 18 weren't that bad they were literally about the same as Wembys LNB pro stats at almost the same exact stage.     Wemby really didn't take off until his 2nd year into that league before he came into the nba.   If you stretch out wemby and saar's number those years to 36 minutes they are right inline with each other.  So if people are saying Saar's numbers are bad then they have to say wemby's was as well.  Which i don't personally believe either of them were that bad considering what both were asked too do.   Even in wemby's 2nd year the numbers are sorta in line with both his and saar's 1st year he just got extended minutes to keep the pace and show the numbers.   His euro league numbers were actually worse or about in line with his numbers from his lnb numbers as well they just look bigger as he got more minutes.   Which actually were also right in line per minute as Saar's. 

Im not here to say wemby isn't a better prospect i think he is and was an amazing prospect.  The problem i have is people trashing on saar like he is some bottom tier reject prospect compared to wemby when they honestly have been pretty similar over the years.  With Wemby imo being a bit better prospect but  if Wemby is tier 1 then i would put Saar as Tier 2  instead of like tier 4 or 5.

[NBASupes]

2 hours ago, TRW said:

Supes I don't see you as a hater. I see you as a passionate enthusiasts who thinks out of the box. A enthusiasts who loves doing his own homework/research on prospects.

Thank you, TRW

[AHF]

PLEASE REMEMBER WE AREN’T HERE TO PSYCHOANALYZE ONE ANOTHER OR OTHERWISE TALK ABOUT OTHER POSTERS.  Please report something that is out of line and refrain from having a discussion about what motives you think someone might have in posting or about their style in posting, etc.  Just respond to the content or leave it alone.  Agree, disagree, etc. but start focusing on the poster and you are going off topic in a bad way.

[NBASupes]

34 minutes ago, Threezus said:

1st off i didn't call you a hater nor did i talk bad about any of the guys you have liked as like quite a few of them as well. 

 

2nd off since you forgot i was right there with you on the Cam Reddish train and crucified a bit as well. 

 

Considering i am a Duke fan and i have literally asked for most players coming from there over the years on this board which is why im so bullish on jalen johnson right now even over moving trae and murray before i would move him.       Also his Australian stats at 18 weren't that bad they were literally about the same as Wembys LNB pro stats at almost the same exact stage.     Wemby really didn't take off until his 2nd year into that league before he came into the nba.   If you stretch out wemby and saar's number those years to 36 minutes they are right inline with each other.  So if people are saying Saar's numbers are bad then they have to say wemby's was as well.  Which i don't personally believe either of them were that bad considering what both were asked too do.   Even in wemby's 2nd year the numbers are sorta in line with both his and saar's 1st year he just got extended minutes to keep the pace and show the numbers.   His euro league numbers were actually worse or about in line with his numbers from his lnb numbers as well they just look bigger as he got more minutes.   Which actually were also right in line per minute as Saar's. 

Im not here to say wemby isn't a better prospect i think he is and was an amazing prospect.  The problem i have is people trashing on saar like he is some bottom tier reject prospect compared to wemby when they honestly have been pretty similar over the years.  With Wemby imo being a bit better prospect but  if Wemby is tier 1 then i would put Saar as Tier 2  instead of like tier 4 or 5.

It's not you, it's the Supes is a hater crew that's align to lessen my opinion and discredit me. 

Too many of us was on that train wreck. I admit, I had some doubts but once we drafted him, I just sold myself into it. Boy oh boy. That one sucked. Cam was a lesson to really make sure the person wants to be what we want him to be. Cam saw McGrady when he saw himself in the mirror. I saw this modern Klay that could defend 1-3. The 1-3 thing happened but the modern Klay, lmao!

Wemby stats with Tony Parker team was really bad. He had a lot of flashes but his role was really hard. To be a center for a Euroleague team with questionable mins was a lot. He had a lot of struggles. 

I just saw Sarr role as way easier to that and Wemby Metz role was as the best player and Sarr would be ready for that in Europe next year for anyone? Idk. I just don't see the comp but I get the comp. I get where you trying to go.

Wemby struggled but he shined the next year in Metz, why can't Sarr for the NBA. That's a major reach but I see what you are trying to do. I just don't know if I agree. Wemby was raw at 17 but so was Luka. At 18, they were the best players in Europe. I don't know if I see the comps. I don't see Sarr as the best player in Europe next year. Hell, I don't think he would start for a EuroLeague team. Maybe start for a Eurocup team like Risacher does

Edited May 27 by NBASupes