Donovan Clingan or Alexander Sarr: Battle of 1st overall pick

[bird_dirt]

14 minutes ago, bird_dirt said:

He doesn’t have to be the best player of this class, just better than Edey, Clingan, or Risacher, aka the primary guys for consideration by either the Hawks or a few Squawkers here. 

If that happens, that’s when I think we should have a reckoning. 

 

9 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Edey is not being considered by the Hawks.  

Please read the bolded parts. 

[thecampster]

18 minutes ago, bird_dirt said:

He doesn’t have to be the best player of this class, just better than Edey, Clingan, or Risacher, aka the primary guys for consideration by either the Hawks or a few Squawkers here. 

If that happens, that’s when I think we should have a reckoning. 

We have yhe top pick. If he's not the best player, then it's a mistake.

[Jody23]

I still think Risacher is the pick at #1, but most likely for the Spurs.  Perhaps the Hawks are willing to let Washington take Sarr to make sure they stay put at #2.  The Rockets could be the wild card, but I suspect Reed Sheppard is high on their board and the real threat of the Hawks taking him in a trade down may deter the Rockets from taking Clingan.

[bird_dirt]

Just now, thecampster said:

We have yhe top pick. If he's not the best player, then it's a mistake.

He’s just needs to be the best pick among those being considered holmes.  

Absolutely NO ONE would’ve ever considered taking Giannis at 1, or 2, or 3, or 4, or 5, 6, 7, 8, 9…. He was the best player, but he wasn’t even drafted in the lottery. No one faults the Cavs for not not taking him 1st, or really even any of the next 13 teams that didn’t pick him. 

And the point here is that anyone who thinks “their” player is better and should be picked before Sarr, but end up being wrong, should stand up and admit they were wrong. 

[Spud2nique]

As a Hawks organization we cannot take this man after the Koncak 85 draft. There should be a rule that if an organization is about to do something stupid that the league won’t allow it due to moral stuff and society.

His stats stink dude is gonna get terrorized on the perimeter by elite guards like TRAE YOUNG.  

I don’t care if it’s a trade down scenario and he’s a 7th pick, don’t do it, Kontract was 5th.

[thecampster]

“Right now all this word that Atlanta is not a situation that WMA wants. Alex Sarr, the top prospect out of Australia, out of Perth Australia, who’s French, he played several different places, went to Overtime Elite. They don’t want him to be a member of the Hawks, which could cost him $9 million in theory over the course of four years. It’s all about that second contract. It’s all about fit.”

 

41 mins ago – via YouTube

 Alex Sarr, Draft, Atlanta Hawks

 

[Final_quest]

With Jalen and Trae here, among others, there’s not enough opportunity for Sarr.  

Wizards seems like he is gonna go to a career graveyard franchise, but he can be a chucker that gets paid.  

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, Final_quest said:

With Jalen and Trae here, among others, there’s not enough opportunity for Sarr.  

Wizards seems like he is gonna go to a career graveyard franchise, but he can be a chucker that gets paid.  

It a much better situation. No expectations and no one cares. He will have a chance to grow. Atlanta is a win now spot.

[Gray Mule]

I wanted Sarr for the Hawks.  If he doesn't want to be here, that makes a difference.

Clingan fits, if we dump Capela, which seems to be the plans.  I wonder, can he hit his free throws?

 

[thecampster]

35 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

 

Cough cough, ahem......where have I heard he isn't a 5 before?

[AHF]

39 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

I wanted Sarr for the Hawks.  If he doesn't want to be here, that makes a difference.

Clingan fits, if we dump Capela, which seems to be the plans.  I wonder, can he hit his free throws?

 

Unfortunately, he couldn't hit them in college.  If we take him, it is going to present two issues in end game scenarios.  (1) Not being able to hit free throws is really rough for him being on the floor offensively.  He shot 52% and 58% in college.  That is in "hack-a-shaq" range if he doesn't improve.  (2) Mobile / perimeter bigs present potential big issues defensively.

If we keep OO that does give us the opportunity for a different look with a more mobile C who can hit free throws although obviously you'd prefer to have your top pick be a contributor in end games.  That will take some development which is not outside the realm of possibility.

[thecampster]

19 hours ago, warcore said:

I guess you chose to just disregard my entire bit about him taking Dre's and Bey's minutes. 

When have we seen Dre or Bey assigned to guard Embiid or Adams? 

I'm happy to respond to your posts, but not if you're picking and choosing what to ignore. 

And just in case it's no clear, the above means CC and OO would still be guarding those players. (If they're still here). 

Don't take it personal. I ignore almost everyone these days.  There is a lot said on here, with some posters playing 3 sides of the same pyramid. I also don't have the patience these days to read entire posts if someone says something I can't get behind or that specifically comes after me. There are far too many scantily clad pictures of Selena Gomez on the internet for me to spend all my time reading every post on Hawksquawk.  

Bey = gone without taking a huge salary decrease.  He's moving on to somewhere else. So yes, those minutes are available, but given a trade down (a scenario I still think is most likely), you can end up with Matas Buzelis or Ron Holland (based on where you pick) + one of the centers or a shooters and improve the roster sooner rather than later.  In a few scenarios, you get control of picks in the next 3 years back and can move on.

Still here players - Given any reasonable return, CC is gone. Folks need to grip that. We are in a cash crunch and CC is set to make $22.3 million this year while not producing much more than Bruno produced at $2.7 million.  Specifically, CC's inability to stretch the floor beyond 5 feet makes Trae/DJ's life miserable.  In the pick n roll scenario, the pop is not an option with CC. If not the pick setter, CC is no threat if he vacates the paint. Even Gobert could score from 10 feet.  CC is an offensive problem in many ways. He is not a post threat, he is not a space eater, he is not a floor stretcher but he's making $22 million.  If we can find a buyer, he's gone and we're moving on from him and will replace him with a center who can hit a 3.  Even Alex Len (check the advanced stats) provided a better offensive option here because of his ability to step out and stretch the defense. CC did almost everything better than Len, but what he does bad, he does very bad. He negatively impacts everyone and if Trae Young, James Harden isn't feeding him....he's a rock in the gears.

That means you either roll into next year with OO starting, Bruno off the bench and random big 3rd man off the bench or you find a big who can stretch the floor or who is dominant down low to replace CC. Its really that simple.  If the center can't be very good offensively next year, he shouldn't be here. We can't "hope" he'll be good. He has to show he will be good.

[JayBirdHawk]

Just a reminder:

Quote

"I'm like, 'No, I don't want to go to Boston. I like it out here in Phoenix," Tatum recalled. "It's cool. The weather is nice. I get a big house, I get a pool. My mom is going to be out here."

Tatum was initially hesitant of Boston at first because he was worried that he wouldn't get much playing time on a Celtics team that had just finished as the No. 1 seed in the Eastern Conference.

"There was a part of me that didn't want to go to Boston because they just were the No. 1 team in the East. They had Isaiah Thomas, Al Horford, [Marcus] Smart, [Jaylen Brown], Jae Crowder," he explained. "I was like, 'Man, I'm not going to play. I'm trying to get buckets.'"

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/jayson-tatum-celtics-coach-krzyzewski-draft-phoenix-suns/

If he's your guy, take him. If he's all about the second contract, he'll do what needs to be done to get one.

 

[Final_quest]

33 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Still here players - Given any reasonable return, CC is gone. Folks need to grip that. We are in a cash crunch and CC is set to make $22.3 million this year while not producing much more than Bruno produced at $2.7 million.  Specifically, CC's inability to stretch the floor beyond 5 feet makes Trae/DJ's life miserable.  In the pick n roll scenario, the pop is not an option with CC. If not the pick setter, CC is no threat if he vacates the paint. Even Gobert could score from 10 feet.  CC is an offensive problem in many ways. He is not a post threat, he is not a space eater, he is not a floor stretcher but he's making $22 million.  If we can find a buyer, he's gone and we're moving on from him and will replace him with a center who can hit a 3.  Even Alex Len (check the advanced stats) provided a better offensive option here because of his ability to step out and stretch the defense. CC did almost everything better than Len, but what he does bad, he does very bad. He negatively impacts everyone and if Trae Young, James Harden isn't feeding him....he's a rock in the gears.

That means you either roll into next year with OO starting, Bruno off the bench and random big 3rd man off the bench or you find a big who can stretch the floor or who is dominant down low to replace CC. Its really that simple.  If the center can't be very good offensively next year, he shouldn't be here. We can't "hope" he'll be good. He has to show he will be good.

I am hoping they can use our TPE in the Capela trade.  Then it is basically preserved another year.  

[AHF]

29 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

I am hoping they can use our TPE in the Capela trade.  Then it is basically preserved another year.  

Although probably academic, I agree that would be nice.

[ShayD]

2 hours ago, thecampster said:

Don't take it personal. I ignore almost everyone these days.  There is a lot said on here, with some posters playing 3 sides of the same pyramid. I also don't have the patience these days to read entire posts if someone says something I can't get behind or that specifically comes after me. There are far too many scantily clad pictures of Selena Gomez on the internet for me to spend all my time reading every post on Hawksquawk.  

Bey = gone without taking a huge salary decrease.  He's moving on to somewhere else. So yes, those minutes are available, but given a trade down (a scenario I still think is most likely), you can end up with Matas Buzelis or Ron Holland (based on where you pick) + one of the centers or a shooters and improve the roster sooner rather than later.  In a few scenarios, you get control of picks in the next 3 years back and can move on.

Still here players - Given any reasonable return, CC is gone. Folks need to grip that. We are in a cash crunch and CC is set to make $22.3 million this year while not producing much more than Bruno produced at $2.7 million.  Specifically, CC's inability to stretch the floor beyond 5 feet makes Trae/DJ's life miserable.  In the pick n roll scenario, the pop is not an option with CC. If not the pick setter, CC is no threat if he vacates the paint. Even Gobert could score from 10 feet.  CC is an offensive problem in many ways. He is not a post threat, he is not a space eater, he is not a floor stretcher but he's making $22 million.  If we can find a buyer, he's gone and we're moving on from him and will replace him with a center who can hit a 3.  Even Alex Len (check the advanced stats) provided a better offensive option here because of his ability to step out and stretch the defense. CC did almost everything better than Len, but what he does bad, he does very bad. He negatively impacts everyone and if Trae Young, James Harden isn't feeding him....he's a rock in the gears.

That means you either roll into next year with OO starting, Bruno off the bench and random big 3rd man off the bench or you find a big who can stretch the floor or who is dominant down low to replace CC. Its really that simple.  If the center can't be very good offensively next year, he shouldn't be here. We can't "hope" he'll be good. He has to show he will be good.

I've come around this draft. I know the roster is getting up there is salary, maybe a DJ and Capela/Hunter trade can ease the cap sheet but if you can come out of this draft with 2 lottery/first round prospects you do it. Ideally you have to address size at the 5, whether it's Clingan, Edey or Ware and you can add one of the wing/PF/SG prospects.

If they determine Sarr is the best player and no good deal can be had for the first pick, then pick Sarr, even if it means playing him at the 4 just to make it work and then find a way to get one of the Centers with a lineup with JJ at the 3, Sarr at 4 and a 5 for an ultra big lineup. It may seem weird and less than ideal for JJ but I think he has the ability to play the 3 sufficiently enough.

If the Cavs can win games with an undersized backcourt and a front court of non shooters in Mobley and Allen, If Magic can win games with a non shooting starting 5, Goga starting 33 games when WCJ broke his hand, Fultz/Black playing minutes at PG, Franz playing SF shooting 28% from 3 and Paolo at PF shooting 33%, and If the Pacers can win games having one of the worst defenses in the league, then so can the Hawks.

The Cavs just had a good system and good defense, The magic won games mostly on defense even with the terrible offense and the Pacers just had too much talented Depth. The Hawks are not far off from these teams and JJ at the 3 and Sarr at the 4 is not as bad as it seems in my opinion. They just have to work the FA and trade market as well as hit their draft picks and they are right back in the mix. Fit matters alot, but the most important fit should be with your start player in Trae at the backcourt and C.

And out of all those teams, the hawks have the best player in Trae. Or you can debate between him and Mitchell. I think both are better than Haliburton and Siakam

[Spud2nique]

Ok you can believe me or not. I can tell a lot by a dude’s pic. This is a pic of a bust.

 

  

The 2024 Harrison Barnes (that’s his ceiling)

[ShooterSays]

Is Lauri still an option at this point? Jeez…

[Carmine]

I was initially lukewarm but have come around on Clingan. My only concern is his shooting. If he had more range and a higher FT % I would not mind taking him #1.

[JayBirdHawk]

2024 NBA Mock draft roundup

1. Atlanta Hawks

USA Today: Zaccherie Risacher, JL Bourg (France)

The Ringer: Zaccherie Risacher, JL Bourg (France)

ESPN: Zaccherie Risacher, JL Bourg (France)

Bleacher Report: Zaccherie Risacher, JL Bourg (France)

Alex Sarr was the longtime top pick on most boards but Risacher has risen to consensus status at the top. Riscaher is a productive wing who showcases his ball handling, shooting, and quick off-ball movement skills. He's not the most polished prospect on the board, though, and needs to improve defensively and scoring at the rim. He's drawn comparisons to Harrison Barnes.

USA Today: "Has the scoring ability, size, length, quickness and athleticism teams are seeking in today’s NBA. Quick release on catch-and-shoots, is able to create off the dribble and runs the court well."

The Ringer: "After working out for the Hawks last week, Risacher seems like the most likely choice at this point. He’s theoretically a 3-and-D wing who can fit in on the team whether or not Atlanta keeps Trae Young... The Hawks still need to work out other candidates for this choice, though, and figure out whether they should trade down or out."

2. Washington Wizards

USA Today: Alex Sarr, Perth (Australia) Wildcats

The Ringer: Alex Sarr, Perth (Australia) Wildcats

ESPN: Alex Sarr, Perth (Australia) Wildcats

Bleacher Report: Alex Sarr, Perth (Australia) Wildcats

Another consensus at No. 2 with the athletic big Sarr. His impressive wingspan (7 feet, 4 inches) at 7 feet tall give him an ideal mix of size, skill, and athleticism on defense. He's a willing passer and hustles hard. He does need to improve on offense, be it as a shooter or finisher at the rim

USA Today: "A strong defender and shot-blocker who plays with force on both ends; has good hands, uses his body well and though he doesn’t have the prettiest shot, he gets it to go in. His brother player, Olivier, is on two-way G League contract with Oklahoma City."

ESPN: "Washington has the runway available to be patient with Sarr's development, making it a strong fit for him -- and vice versa -- on paper. Sarr arguably has the greatest upside available here, with the physical attributes to be a top defender, as well as the makings of a useful offensive skill set as a finisher and improving floor-spacer."

3. Houston Rockets (via Brooklyn Nets)

USA Today: Reed Sheppard, G, Kentucky

The Ringer: Reed Sheppard, G, Kentucky

ESPN: Reed Sheppard, G, Kentucky

Bleacher Report: Reed Sheppard, G, Kentucky

More consensus at No. 3 here. Sheppard's calling card is a mix of standout shooting - he shot 52.1% from deep on 4.4 attempts per game - and energetic defense. Despite a small frame (187 pounds at 6 feet, 3 inches tall), he is far from a liability on that end. He's a good playmaker as well but could use more reps against NBA-level on-ball pressure.

USA Today: "Can flat out score, especially off screens, using floaters or pulling up in transition. Lacks elite athleticism but handles ball well enough to warrant look at point guard. Will compete defensively, and rebounds well for his size. Performed well at the NBA draft combine with his shot and impressive 42-inch vertical leap."

Bleacher Report: "If the Rockets stick, they should love what Reed Sheppard brings to their rotation: elite shooting, passing and intangibles/character that scouts and executives praised after interviewing him at the NBA combine."

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2024/06/19/2024-nba-mock-draft-roundup-picks-top/74151708007/