2024-25 Insider Thread

[Peoriabird]

Wasn't Vit starting for this team last year at some point?

[Peoriabird]

Just now, macdaddy said:

He's played in less than 150 games in his career.  He did avg 22 min in 61 games and has a career avg of 5 points a game.  in the pelicans lone playoff series last year he wasn't in the rotation at all.   So I consider that not signifcant but it's borderline I guess.   I do have hopes for him but hope isn't much in the NBA. 

Just admit you were wrong instead of moving the goal post.  DD has been a part of the rotation since he has been the league

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Also Mathews was playing 26 minutes per game in Houston his 3rd year in the league

Minutes on a 20 win team.  Lots of players can get minutes in the NBA.   That doesn't make them a significant part of a rotation.  But I guess I should have been more clear about.   I like Dyson but we're still talking about a raw talent.  Mathews is a borderline NBA player.   Does anyone disagree with that?

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Just admit you were wrong instead of moving the goal post.  DD has been a part of the rotation since he has been the league

I give up.  I said significant part.   He was so significant they decided they didn't need him to play in the playoffs.   

We can disagree.  Doesn't make either of us wrong.  

[Gray Mule]

6 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Wasn't Vit starting for this team last year at some point?

Yes he was. I believe.  At least he was a major rotational piece.

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

Backup PG, SF and PF are my biggest worries as far as roster depth.

If Trae is out, we are going to be hurting given our options as primary playmakers.  As long as he is healthy, I think we are fine with 14 minutes or so a game of Daniels, Bogi, Bufkin, etc. teaming to move the ball.  I also think Risacher should be better at passing than Hunter and JJ is a strong passer at PF which helps.

The only guys who can defend big wings on the team consistently, imo, are Hunter and Risacher.  If Risacher struggles as a rookie on the defensive end that will be very problematic.  If Hunter suffers his annual extended injury we are going to be in some trouble (but if  Risacher can handle opposing big wings then much better off than last year).  Both would be a really bad position for the team.

I don't list JJ as someone to guard big wings because we are a two man shop at PF and I'm not fully convinced Nance can play extended minutes there so I think we will need JJ at PF for nearly all the minutes he plays.  These are Nance's minutes from last season and they are basically all at center:

As long as JJ is healthy then I don't think it is asking too much for Nance to play some time there.  He did when he was younger and it doesn't seem like a huge stretch.  But if he has slowed down some then that leaves us very thin at the position and for the same reason you'd be reluctant to slot JJ at SF you would likewise be reluctant to slot Hunter at PF (lack of depth at SF).

I don't ever want to see us having to give heavy minutes to guys like Mat(t)hews again.  (I'd love to see someone like Mathews or Gueye, etc. improve enough to earn more minutes but I don't count on either one being a competent defender at this stage of their careers.)

Thought this was relevant from another thread given what we are talking about here.

[Peoriabird]

5 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Minutes on a 20 win team.  Lots of players can get minutes in the NBA.   That doesn't make them a significant part of a rotation.  But I guess I should have been more clear about.   I like Dyson but we're still talking about a raw talent.  Mathews is a borderline NBA player.   Does anyone disagree with that?

Oh god.  I can't take it.  You win

[AHF]

6 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

Yes he was. I believe.  At least he was a major rotational piece.

He and Mathews were forced into minutes due to lack of options.  I'd like us to have better options or to see them improve enough to earn more regular minutes.  I don't want to see us forced into desperation options which I think applies to both of them last season.  Vit showed more more defensively down the stretch so I have more hope there.  Mathews is a nice tool to have on the bench as a situational sniper but not someone I want playing regular minutes as a defender on this team.   He has been highly negative in a number of metrics every season of his career including last year and what I see in the numbers matches with what I saw on the floor as far as someone who was there less because he had made a leap and more because we lacked quality depth.

I consider both Garrison Mathews and Vit Krejci to be borderline rosterable players and neither to be rotation worthy on a playoff team at this stage in their development.  I don't mind either on the roster but I'd love a stronger player signed as a FA in Zeller's spot.

[Peoriabird]

7 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I give up.  I said significant part.   He was so significant they decided they didn't need him to play in the playoffs.   

We can disagree.  Doesn't make either of us wrong.  

I'll make this one last point and leave this subject along because you have made up you mind about this issue.  Guess who else was not a part of the Hawks regular rotation and average 5.8 points per game prior to last year... Yep Jalen Johnson

[macdaddy]

The whole point is this is another season (so far) where we are counting on unproven, inexperienced NBA players to make big leaps in order for us to be a playoff team.    How's that?  Anyone disagree?

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

I'll make this one last point and leave this subject along because you have made up you mind about this issue.  Guess who else was not a part of the Hawks regular rotation and average 5.8 points per game prior to last year... Yep Jalen Johnson

And AJ Griffin.   I don't know what you think i've made up my mind about.  I'm mildly optimistic about the season.   Just pointing out that we are depending on a LOT of growth from inexperienced NBA players to be a playoff team.  Do you disagree?

[Peoriabird]

11 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I give up.  I said significant part.   He was so significant they decided they didn't need him to play in the playoffs.   

We can disagree.  Doesn't make either of us wrong.  

And guess who played fewer minutes than DD his 1st 2 years in the league...Dejounte Murray anyone?

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

And guess who played fewer minutes than DD his 1st 2 years in the league...Dejounte Murray anyone?

I don't understand what point you are trying to make

[Peoriabird]

15 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I don't understand what point you are trying to make

My point is that you have no point.  1st of all what you said was absolutely false and secondly, your premise doesn't hold water.  There are plenty of young players who don't start right away but blossom in the 2nd or 3rd year.  Its pretty common.  I just gave you several example of players on the Hawks who did exactly that.  Even you admit that it would take Zacch some time to adjust so you already know.  But you want to make some argument just to complain about the front office's strategy going forward.  Be my guess

[kg01]

This thread is grand. 

[macdaddy]

4 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

My point is that you have no point.  1st of all what you said was absolutely false and secondly, your premise doesn't hold water.  There are plenty of young players who don't start right away but blossom in the 2nd or 3rd year.  Its pretty common.  I just gave you several example of players on the Hawks who did exactly that.  Even you admit that it would take Zacch some time to adjust so you already know.  But you want to make some argument just to complain about the front office's strategy going forward.  Be my guess

Show me where I said young players don't improve.   

My only point is that we are relying on inexperienced players to improve in order for us to become a playoff team.  I never said it was not going to happen.   

But again.   Do you disagree that that's where we are?  Laying our hopes on improvement of inexperienced players?  How'd that work the last three years?  It didn't.  I hope it does this time.

[bleachkit]

49 minutes ago, akay said:

 

@bleachkit you make a claim, immediately get disproven, then go into this other random thought.

 Why make claims then jump to other ones as soon as you get called out for saying something the can proven otherwise? 

Feel like the points are disingenuous rather than actually showing that Trae really is poor at closing out or whatever take you’re feeling at the moment

I was disproven by the 23/24 "in the clutch" stats? Here's a stat for you. Outside of the ECF season, we have basically been a .500 team with Trae. 

[LucastheThird]

The 2024 Hawksquawk offseason

[JayBirdHawk]

It's all about HOPE. What we hope and PRAY (for those that do) the less experienced players will provide on the positive side of the ledger.

[Peoriabird]

8 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

I was disproven by the 23/24 "in the clutch" stats? Here's a stat for you. Outside of the ECF season, we have basically been a .500 team with Trae. 

The Hawks have won 45% of their game with Young in the line up and 45% without him in the line up