2024-25 Insider Thread

[capstone21]

I do not want Ayton.

He is lazy, me first and a terrible defender.

The team needs defense… especially from the 5.  Ayton will not improve this team.  I have a feeling he will make us worse.

I would rather stay with CC than go after Ayton.  There is a reason why PHX and now Portland are so willing to jettison him.

[JayBirdHawk]

8 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

To be very clear, I wasn't advocating for that deal.  I was just looking for what worked financially.  It really doesn't seem like Portland is a good trade partner.  

posted earlier:

CC, Bruno and Mathews for Ayton works from a salary perspective.

[Hawkish]

8 minutes ago, capstone21 said:

I do not want Ayton.

He is lazy, me first and a terrible defender.

The team needs defense… especially from the 5.  Ayton will not improve this team.  I have a feeling he will make us worse.

I would rather stay with CC than go after Ayton.  There is a reason why PHX and now Portland are so willing to jettison him.

Right — After watching some Kessler tape, I’d be interested if it weren’t for Ainge.

Edited Thursday at 12:41 PM by Hawkish

[RedDawg#8]

And so it begins. Months and months of debating about guys who will not be a Hawks uniform anytime soon.

 

[Dragitoff]

I hate Jerami Grant is on that horrible contract. He's a lengthy defender that can guard multiple positions and shot the ball extremely well last season. That contract though

[Phunkabilly]

@Sothron @thecampster

Are you guys able to elaborate on our talks with the Spurs and why that fell through?  From seeing what Campster wrote, it sounded like 1 for 4/8 was on the table, but the Hawks declined.  From reading what Soth wrote, it sounded like the Spurs may have only been offering 4 + scraps for 1.  Just curious where each side's final offer stood at. 

[JayBirdHawk]

This was @NBASupes post from June 9th regarding ZR:

Quote

There is a lot going on behind the scenes. A lot. There is even a chance where Atlanta ends up with 1 and 3. There is a lot going on. A lot. 

I'll say this, Murray trade talks are extremely hot and there are teams interested that just wasn't even close or interested at the trade deadline 

There is a reason why Clingan has the interest he has. He's seen as the #1 or #2 best center on the market with Claxton and many see Claxton returning to Brooklyn so the gap between the next player regardless of draft, trade, or FA is considered massive. Regardless of what I personally think, Hartenstein is seen as the #3 guy and after that, it's all over the place, you got Edey, Jonas, CC, or even going potential like Missi or Ware that's the next option and the gap is seen as massive to execs. That's why Clingan is so high with teams.

While teams thought Atlanta was gonna tank and trade Trae to SA and it was a done deal. They have come to realize Atlanta isn't open to trading Trae without a clear overpay like Mikal and Brooklyn. From what I've gathered, no one is even close. That Trae market is similar to Murray which is two quality 1sts. Of course, Atlanta had no interest and even then, they want to make it work with Trae due to their personal love for him as well as business most importantly. 

Capela has a lot of interest just due to a dead market. A lot of teams have called about OO but it seems like outside of NO which has wings Atlanta covets, it doesn't seem like he's been in trade talks. There are 8 teams calling about CC. Last year, it was just Houston who had a deal with us and pulled out because Cam Whitmore fell to them. Teams more than ever need multiple centers so he's getting a lot of interest. 

It's no lie that Atlanta is targeting Clingan. Maybe it's a tad overrated based on what I've got this morning. He's not the #1 player on their current big board, Risacher is. He's not even #2 like I thought, Sarr is. He's just the #1 center and as I just mentioned, many teams see the gap between Claxton and Clingan to the next tier as massive regardless if I personally have Edey as the top overall guy. I was told that sentiment isn't shared by any team which I felt could change due to some of the private workouts. That said, I was told he is in the top 3 of some team's BB which makes me feel like okay, not everyone is a dipshit. 

Right now, Sarr is the top guy for most bad teams with Sheppard being the top guy for some other bad teams. Houston is the only team with Sheppard as the top guy and they aren't bad. Risacher is the #1 guy for most average to great teams. He's clearly the top dawg. No surprise, teams like wings who are NBA ready, can shoot, play smart, defend multiple positions and can play off the ball at a high level. Whereas bad teams want potential stars. They want a potential building block even if they are raw, they got time and patience. I do believe teams are higher on Risacher than I am. Based on the Intel on Sarr, many question his floor like I do. The Sarr takes are a lot closer to my takes than Hawksquawk.net or Hawks Twitter/Reddit. 

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

1 minute ago, Phunkabilly said:

@Sothron @thecampster

Are you guys able to elaborate on our talks with the Spurs and why that fell through?  From seeing what Campster wrote, it sounded like 1 for 4/8 was on the table, but the Hawks declined.  From reading what Soth wrote, it sounded like the Spurs may have only been offering 4 + scraps for 1.  Just curious where each side's final offer stood at. 

When you consider that the Spurs traded #8 for a future unprotected pick and a swap, my sense is they weren't willing to include 8 in the trade up but was offering something less.

[JayBirdHawk]

12 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

And so it begins. Months and months of debating about guys who will not be a Hawks uniform anytime soon.

 

[Final_quest]

I'm warming up to Risacher, and understand the thinking as he is much more fluid and Hunter is robotic.  If the game is really won with perimeter players these days, you have a Klay Thompson style guy that fits with Trae and Jalen pretty well.  

That being said, I echo these concerns:

Not sure what offers we actually turned down where we could have traded down, but I like many of the guys taken later in the lottery and would have rather had two prospects.  It sounds like the PR hit of "getting scraps" for the #1 overall pick was part of the decision making process.  

[Phunkabilly]

8 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

When you consider that the Spurs traded #8 for a future unprotected pick and a swap, my sense is they weren't willing to include 8 in the trade up but was offering something less.

Yeah, very possible.  It's also possible that SA wanted more from us than just #1 for 4/8.  If either scenario is what actually happened, then I'll be a lot less irritated at the Hawks for not pulling the trigger.

[thecampster]

12 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

When you consider that the Spurs traded #8 for a future unprotected pick and a swap, my sense is they weren't willing to include 8 in the trade up but was offering something less.

The exact opposite. Their trade of 8 shows they didn't value picking at that slot. They wanted Risacher and when we didn't deal, they settled for picking at 4 and trading 8.

[JayBirdHawk]

After all the trade speculation only 6 first-round picks changed hands Wednesday night.

[theheroatl]

Ayton is an upgrade to Capela and OO. If you don't see it, not sure you are looking at basketball.

[Hawkish]

1 minute ago, theheroatl said:

Ayton is an upgrade to Capela and OO. If you don't see it, not sure you are looking at basketball.

If you are focused on physical traits, I would agree.  However, is it odd to you that despite these elite physical traits, teams are willing to move him for peanuts?  It just doesn’t pass the smell test.

[theheroatl]

2 minutes ago, Hawkish said:

If you are focused on physical traits, I would agree.  However, is it odd to you that despite these elite physical traits, teams are willing to move him for peanuts?  It just doesn’t pass the smell test.

No matter what, he produces consistently.  I can't speak to the coaching and development environment in Phoenix and Portland.

[Phunkabilly]

16 minutes ago, thecampster said:

The exact opposite. Their trade of 8 shows they didn't value picking at that slot. They wanted Risacher and when we didn't deal, they settled for picking at 4 and trading 8.

Camp, just to clarify, are you saying that your source told you that the Spurs were offering #4 and #8 for #1?  Seems like Soth's source was indicating that the Spurs' interest in #1 may have been a little overstated and weren't offering that much for #1.

[kg01]

30 minutes ago, thecampster said:

The exact opposite. Their trade of 8 shows they didn't value picking at that slot. They wanted Risacher and when we didn't deal, they settled for picking at 4 and trading 8.

So we ... screwed the Spurs (basically), causing them to have to waste a 1st?

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. 

[JeffS17]

3 minutes ago, Phunkabilly said:

Camp, just to clarify, are you saying that your source told you that the Spurs were offering #4 and #8 for #1?  Seems like Soth's source was indicating that the Spurs' interest in #1 may have been a little overstated and weren't offering that much for #1.

This question underlies the issue with how some people are digesting the insider information.  The insiders on this board have reiterated over the years we are getting leaks primarily from discussions, not hard offers.  The Spurs are notoriously tight lipped so anything dealing with them would be extremely unlikely to be leaked or if it is, tough to gauge the authenticity.  So I highly doubt anyone other than a handful of people in the Spurs front office actually knew what the Spurs would be willing to deal or not, regardless of discussions they had with other teams.  They were clearly happier to use their #8 for an unprotected 1st and a pick swap in future drafts, than to use it in a package to move up a few draft slots in a notoriously flat draft class.  This makes a lot of sense for them as they probably expect their picks to be in the late 20s by 2030 rather than adding more young guys to an already youthful roster.

A good litmus test of the feasibility of trades is just imagining yourself as a Spurs fan.  If we are salivating at the idea of getting 4 and 8, or even more than that (some reports mentioned our unprotected firsts back), how do you think Spurs fans are digesting that?  They're calling us delusional.  If all parties are waffling on the value and if we should pull the trigger, that's probably a real deal construct that could feasibly happen, but there is still no guarantee both parties were willing.  So judging our FO for moves we think they should have made without actually knowing if those moves were available is shaky work, at best.

[JeffS17]

22 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

Ayton is an upgrade to Capela and OO. If you don't see it, not sure you are looking at basketball.

Ayton Hawks DNA checker:

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Spoiler

NEGATIVE