Josh Smith Falls to 11 again?

[JTFan31]

On NBAdraft.net Josh Smith falls again in their latest mock draft to 11. Is there something that they know that we dont?

Why a freak of nature like this will fall to 11?

[Boondocks]

He's at 4 here

http://www.draftcity.com/mocks/2004.htm

I like nbadraft.net, but what you just mentioned is what they do. When things aren't happening (as there aren't any all-star games, regular competition ended and no workouts at the moment) they still shift players stock up and down to keep you interested in the new mock.

[emeans]

He can shift up and down on nbadraft.net all he wants.....All I know is if he is there at 6 WE BETTER take him.

No questions about it!!!

[Traceman]

Why MUST we draft him if he's there at #6? You guys are DREAMING if you think he is going to come into the league like Lebron and Carmelo and be an impact player off the bat. I think he is more like Jonathan Bender or best case Al Harrington in that it is going to take him some time to develop. If we do take him, fine. I just hope everyone doesn't expect him to do anything of significance until his 3rd year or so.

Actually, I thought JR Smith looked like the better prospect between the two in the McDonald's game. JR certainly has a FAR better J at this stage and he's just as athletic. JR lacks great handles and he's not as tall as Josh but I think he is the more skilled player at this point.

[KB21]

I disagree.

I wouldn't compare Josh Smith's upside to Al Harrington. Smith is a much better athlete with better all around basketball skills.

JR Smith is a heck of an athlete, but looking better than Josh Smith in one game doesn't make him a better prospect. JR had a great day with his perimeter shooting during that game, but Josh Smith has had games where he nails 5,6, or 7 three pointers. They both suffer from a lack of consistency with their jumper. At this point, Josh Smith is the better ball handler with the better mid range game. Josh is also the better defender between the two, though JR has the ability to be a good defender.

Josh Smith has been on the NBA's radar for a while, dating back to when he played at McEachern high school. JR Smith is a guy that not many people mentioned as a potential high school to NBA prospect until he had that great McDonald's AA game. JR Smith sounds to me a lot more like a Jonathan Bender than Josh Smith does.

Neither one is a sure thing. If the Hawks draft based on sure things though, chances are, they will make a mistake.

A player that could gain some steam for the Hawks is Devin Harris. He's a Sam Cassell type of point guard who could have the type of immediate impact that Kirk Hinrich had.

If the Hawks can't land Howard, I think their guy may ultimately be Andris Biedrins.

[emeans]

Traceman....No one knows what anyone will do on the NBA level. We can try to make educated guesses and decisions. The draft is what it is and that is a hit or miss event that only shows its success when the year starts or a few years down the line. Some do well, some do excellent, some do terrible. That is the nature of the draft.

Saying this I can say no one can definitively say what Josh Smith will do on the NBA level, HOWEVER we can go off of what we see and what scouts and his coaches say about him. You can't totally evaluate a player off of one or two all-star high school games, even though Josh had a solid game.

Point in case. Jonathan Bender broke Michael Jordans record in that game...Is he even on the same planet as Michael Jordan?? Kobe Bryant was outscored and outdone by guess who....The Hawks on S. Jackson...Is he on the same planet as Kobe?? Get my point....

JR Smith looked very good in the McDonalds game especially from the outside. I was very impressed and wouldn't be angry if we drafted him, however it would be Josh before JR.

What I saw in Josh when he got his playing time was pure unleashed potential and talent. He didn't play as many minutes as JR Smith and All-star games seem to be about show casing MY INDIVIDUAL skills. When he did get in he was impressive defensively and offensive, not MVP type impressive but nevertheless impressive. Josh has more dimensions to his game than JR Smith. Josh can do it inside and outside. He can play at the 1, 2, 3 and even the 4 position on the floor. Can JR Smith do that??

Secondly and very importantly Josh has been given the ULTIMATE praise by one of the best High School Coaches in America as being the BEST PLAYER HE HAS EVER COACHED. This is coming from the mouth of a man, who by the way, coached Carmelo Anthony and a host of All-Star NBA players. His coach said this kid can do it all better than any of those all-stars at the High school level.

Lastly at one point he was projected to be the SECOND pick in the draft.

Again, if this kid is there at #6, WE WOULD BE FOOLS not to select him.

[Traceman]

and I don't think he's as skilled as Harrington was coming out of highschool. He IS a better athlete than Harrington. He certainly doesn't rebound, handle or shoot the ball as well as Harrington. He doesn't have anywhere NEAR the post game that Harrington does either. Smith IS a better athlete and in fairness to him, he's a 3 whereas Harrington is a 3/4 but Harrington was/is the more skilled player.

As for the JR/Josh Smith comparison, I don't know who the better player is or will be, I just know what I saw. If you go by the scouting reports, most of these guys are going to be great. You have to take them with a grain of salt. That being said, one game certainly does not make JR a better prospect but I did like what I saw from JR better. I just though that JR looked like a more skilled player. He might not be but that's what it looke like to me.

As for who sounds more like Jonathan Bender, I think they BOTH are going to need 3 years before we'll have a clue what they can be. JR's game is a lot like DeShawn Stephenson's game coming out of highschool. JR looks to be a LITTLE better athlete with a better J but they are of similar size and skills as highschoolers. The jury is still out on DeShawn but he still has a chance to be a very good player. Of course it has taken him 3 years or so just to get where he is now and Bender took 4 years.

As for Devin Harris, I think he is more of a sure thing than either Josh or JR because he has proven to be consistently good against FAR better competititon than either of those guys has faced. I could certainly see the Hawks taking him and if they do, I doubt they will be disappointed. I can see the Cassell comparisons but Harris is quicker and a better athlete. NOBODY has that Sam Cassell basketball savvy though.

I think Ben Gordon is more of a sure thing than Josh or JR as well but unless we get rid of JT, he makes little sense for us in my opinion.

As for Biedrins, I have no opinion because I haven't seen him play. He SOUNDS intriguing but there is no consensus out there that he is a top 5 pick as there was with Yao, Millicic and Gasol. In addition, would Billy Knight have the guts to draft an offensively-challenged Euro player with this team desperately needing to make a splash with their pick? I'd be surprised.

[Traceman]

If we draft Josh Smith at #6 because Billy Knight thinks he is the best player left on the board, that is more than fine by me. What I'm saying is that I don't know how you can say we would be FOOLS not to draft him when you have only seen the guy play ONE TIME! I guess he just didn't impress me enough to say that. There will likely be guys on the board at #6 who have either proven more than Smith (Harris, Gordon) or guys who have just as much upside (Livingston, Biedrins, Deng). If Billy Knight takes one of them instead of Josh, I'll just hope he made the right decision.

I respect the fact that Smith's coach thinks he was a better highschool player than Carmelo but even if that is the case, will he realize the potential that he has? Carmelo is 10x the player he was in highschool now. Heck, Michael Jordan got cut from his highschool team!

[emeans]

I have seen Josh in two All-Star High School games and some clips of some of his games and camps. The other information has been scouting reports, sports specials and his coach. So I have seen him much more than ONE time.

Just because a player has played against better competition (College) doesn't mean he will translate into a better NBA player. We have seen that with Garnett, Lebron, McGrady, Kobe, Stoudemire and more. These guys should have argueably been the 1st pick in their respective drafts.

I would not want to be like the New Orleans Hornets (Charlotte), saying man I wish we would have not passed on Kobe even though they drafted him.

Again this is not an exact science so both of us can't guarantee anything. All I am saying is based on what I have seen, potential, talent, scouting reports and coaches....we would be crazy not to get this guy at #6, which by the way I don't think he will be there at #6.

[DominiqueWilkins]

I like checking NBADRAFT.net out, but I give the edge to draftcity!! NBADRAFT.net is a bit slow on alot of the players, and draftcity.com are most of the time right on top of things!!

By the way to the person who thinks JR Smith was better because of the McDonalds All-American game. JR Smith doesn't even know how to play defense yet!!

[Weez]

all highschoolers suck at D coming out cause they've never really had to play it. Josh Smith's blocks are impressive. But fact of the matter is that these guys have been able to play D through athletic ability up until this point. but they're ALL like this ~ they're offensive players, not defensive. I don't think any HS has come out after being tauted for his toughness, agressiveness, and ability to play D for obvious reasons that I don't have to explain.

[DominiqueWilkins]

True...True!!

From what I have seen out of both Josh Smith and JR Smith, I have seen more flaws out of JR Smith. Josh Smith atleast has more upside on D.

I would be happy to draft both guys, but JR Smith has more to work on at this point!!

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all highschoolers suck at D coming out cause they've never really had to play it. Josh Smith's blocks are impressive. But fact of the matter is that these guys have been able to play D through athletic ability up until this point. but they're ALL like this ~ they're offensive players, not defensive. I don't think any HS has come out after being tauted for his toughness, agressiveness, and ability to play D for obvious reasons that I don't have to explain.

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[Diesel]

So some of your assessment is true, Smith won't have the same type of rebounding numbers as Harrington and probably won't post up like Harrington. By that same token, Harrington is still not all that he should be.

But the fact that Smith's Coach Steve Smith... Put him in the category with: Stackhouse, Mello, and every other player that he has coached and said... Smith is better. On the floor, Smith is a difference maker. I watched the MAAG... For whatever reason, Smith didn't play a lot of minutes, but when he did get in the game, he had impact on both sides. You asked about JR Smith. I have said it before, I would not waste my time with JR Smith. He looked like a kid on the floor who hit a few lucky shots. He couldn't match the athleticism or court Saavy that I saw in Josh Smith in the 4-5 games I have seen him play...

I think Josh Smith will make an immediate impact if he gets enough playing time. Are we looking at next years D. Wade? Maybe. When It's all said and done...4 years down the road, I think it may be:

1. Howard.

2. Livingston.

3. Okafur.

4. Josh Smith....

5. Kris Humphries.

Who show to be the best of the class.

[Traceman]

He has beautiful form on his J and he was able to shoot it effortlessly from well beyond the 3 point line. All of the scouting reports I've read on him say that he is a great catch and shoot guy with unlimited range. His weaknesses is said to be his lack of ballhandling ability.

As far as athleticism goes, JR is PLENTY athletic enough even if he is not quite the athlete that Josh is. He had some VERY impressive dunks both in the MAAG and in the MAAG dunk contest.

At any rate, I don't know that JR will be better than Josh down the road, I just thought he looked like the better prospect based on what little I saw. I don't profess to KNOW that JR will better than Josh down the road.

Who knows who is going to be the best player out of the class. I think Okafor and Howard are the only sure fire impact players in the class and Howard's impact might not be really felt for 3 years. I think guys like the Smiths, Livingston, Deng, Harris and Gordon all have star potential but they could all not pan out just as easily.

[JTFan31]

JR is a very good player but he does not have the upside that Josh has. Josh is 6'9 and still growing, this kid in 3 years can very well be 6'11 with 3 point range and great athleticism. Josh is definitely worth the 6th pick and JR isn't. JR is basically just a 3 point shooter with some penetration abilities and mid range game, Josh goes inside and out, he is a freak of nature and will go inside and shove it down people's throat. Honestly we need fan base, and Josh is the better player and will become the better player plus he will bring the highlight film that we have been missing since Nique. We will be crazy if Josh is there at 6 and we do not choose him.

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Raw. So very raw. Smith, as amazing a prospect he is, does not have anything amounting to a complete game (on offense or defense). While he can leap high, that is generally all he can do on offense. His handle is not yet proficient enough to be able to drive against the better defenders in the NBA. Nor is his outside shot consistent enough (some games he can get very hot though) to deserve respect from a smart defender who would rather lay off and prevent the drive, daring Smith to shoot. Most of his scoring comes near the basket where he can simply sky over the smaller defenders or from putbacks. He cannot yet create his own shot consistently. His defense, other than the eerie shotblocking ability, is atrocious. For all his speed and athleticism he doesn't have the lateral quickness to play the faster players on the perimeter. He is also very lax on defense, barely trying at times. He simply cannot be asked to cover any better than average offensive player on the perimeter. The key in his weaknesses can be summed up in one word really: consistency. He needs more consistency instead of simply the flashes that he does show.

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Basically according to this his weaknesses are consistent shooting and defense. Well let me inform you and a tender age of 18, most highschoolers dont play much defense, the defense will come in the intensity of the NBA. As to shooting, god sake he is only 18, his shooting will definitely improve, im not saying he will be the next Reggie Miller, but he is only 18, the same way Newble improved his shooting, by the time he is 21 he will also be a better shooter. Josh will be huge in this league, he must be picked at 6 if he is there.

[Traceman]

How can you read that quote you just posted and say we would be CRAZY if we passed on Smith at #6? I see just as many reasons to be concerned as I see reasons to get excited. I certainly see Smith's potential but a lot of guys with great potential don't end up living up to the potential and even if they do, it is YEARS down the road. For recent examples, see Kwame Brown, Tyson Chandler, DerMarr Johnson, Darius Miles, Stromile Swift, Jonathan Bender, etc.

I certainly could see Knight passing on Smith at #6 and taking a more sure thing like Devin Harris or Ben Gordon. Worse case scenario for either of those guys is still a pretty damn good player. I could also see him taking Deng or Livingston over Smith if either is still around at #6. I don't know enough about Biedrins but who says he doesn't have more potential than Smith?

For those of you who think I don't like Smith and/or who think I am opposed to drafting him at #6, you're wrong. I think he has the potential to be a very good player and if Knight takes him at #6, that will be fine with me. What I'm saying is that the draft is still more than a month away and who knows who will rise up the draft boards by then?

[Diesel]

Lucky might not be the right word, but his shot wasn't something he can do in the NBA. He was at halfcourt tossing up shots. I'm sorry, his shot selection looked like that of a kid who figured if I throw it up and can hit.

JR is not so athletic.. I mean, he can dunk... On the break... Sheez, Brent Barry can do that. But what about him coming through the lane in traffic? What about backdoor when there are people on the court? He can't hold a candle to Josh Smith's in Athletic ability.

Mark these words... JR Smith will be the new Forte...

Down the road and up the road, Josh will be much better than JR Smith...

You're comparing the next Tmac to the next Forte.

[emeans]

Traceman...We both agree that the draft is a crap shot and a player may pan out or he may not...Guess what... this logic goes for College players too!!

How can you say that Ben Gordon and Devin Harris are more of a sure thing?? These guys may be a flop in the NBA.

[KB21]

I think Josh Smith has the chance to be a Tracy McGrady type of player without the back injury problems

I think JR Smith has the chance to be a Vince Carter type of player.

Like McGrady, I don't think Josh Smith would have improved his game a lot at the college level. I do think JR Smith could have used a couple of years at North Carolina. He would have been a guaranteed top 3 or 4 pick in two years, whereas now, he is a player that might go in the 15-20 range.

Atlanta has a great chance to get both players if they want them. I really question the idea of drafting two high school players though, unless the two are Howard and Josh Smith.

This Smith vs Smith discussion will turn out to be a moot discussion, IMO, because I've got a feeling that Atlanta will somehow come out of this draft with Dwight Howard. Call it luck or divine intervention, but Atlanta will be in a position to get Dwight Howard either through a trade up or the luck of the lottery.

[Iman]

From the little I've read/seen, Josh reminds me of a modern day, slightly larger Dominique. If we pick around number 6 then I hope we take him. JR looked to be a very good shooter to me. I didnt feel like his shot selection was bad, I felt like he knew he was taking outrageous shots and normally wouldnt do that but was just showing out at an exhibition. I guess he reminded me of a SG version of Marbury.

I'd like to see us luck up in the lottery and get Howard with our early first rounder and then JR at number 17 would go well with him to me. Then make sure we take some more ready for the NBA players in the second such as Duhon, etc.