Nicholasp27 Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: when we have Chillz, JJ, Al, JC, JS all playing 2-4? Chillz=Childress JJ=Joe Johnson, who will hopefully be pg, not 2/3 Al=Al Harrington JC=??? Josh Childress again!?!? JS=Josh Smith AGAIN, we have the playing time for ALL of those guys to get 30+mpg...the problem is not PT, it's starting roles...even if jj can't play pg 30mpg, he can at least start at pg for 10mins and then move over to the 2 when we make subs... jj/chill/marvin/smoove/center should be our starting lineup next fall if al is traded and marvin develops... we do NOT have a logjam...we just have the potential to have the deepest team at 2-4 in the league...if jj CAN play pg well and salim can or ivey can or we sign/draft/trade for a good backup pg and then we get a true starting center to play in front of zaza, we'd have one of the deepest teams! if everyone that we have now pans out, then all we need is TWO more players: backup pg and starting c (or great backup if zaza becomes good starter) and we are DEEP...teams won't see a bad player... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATL_BALLER Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: How do you see the seeds of Marvin Growing (now that you're backing down off your opinion)... Where do you see me backing down? In fact, I reiterated my point to Walter: Let's not call Marvin the next Tim Thomas until he shows us that's what he is. My guess is that he'll far exceed Tim's production. As Billy Madison says: "Reading is Good." Diesel, you should try it. Quote: How do you think Marvin will mature on the court when we have Chillz, JJ, Al, JC, JS all playing 2-4? You know if JS bloosoms and AL is resigned, MWill will never develop right? IF Al is resigned, then as BK noted, that's at the least 33 minutes a piece for the trio of Smoove, Al, and Marvin to share the 3-4. (the 2 is irrelevent for them - and based on what BK has said, JC is relegated to the backcourt). That's plenty of floor time for Marvin to develop, especially in the early stages. If he does in fact blow up, then Al can be moved for another piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Diesel Posted August 18, 2005 Author Premium Member Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 IF we do not have a logjam, why do you propose trading AL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATL_BALLER Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 It's called dealing from a strength (not a logjam) to address a weakness (center, backup point). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominiqueWilkins Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: I agree with keeping Al. Without him we have no post presence. Harrington's not a post presence anyways, have you seen his two moves that always get shut down? I'm not trying to hate on Al Harrington, but he's far from being the low post player we are needing, and I don't see a future for him with the Hawks. When it comes time to resign Al Harrington, how much are you willing to see the Hawks resign him for? Are you willing to see the Hawks pay out even 8 million a year for him? 7? 6? Or even more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Diesel Posted August 18, 2005 Author Premium Member Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: It's called dealing from a strength (not a logjam) to address a weakness (center, backup point). I won't get into your weak attempt to change the definition. I will in fact use your lame definition. It was a "strength" when we drafted Marvin. PG and C were "weakness" that we failed to address in that draft. The point is still the same.. If Marvin is not shown to be significantly better than the guys we picked AND Smoove, we have wasted our draft! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATL_BALLER Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: If Marvin is not shown to be significantly better than the guys we picked AND Smoove, we have wasted our draft! I agree with that statement, and I have never contended Marvin will realize his immense potential. On the other hand, it is actually YOU who is backing off your opinion. At the start of the thread, you said, "after people find out he's the next Tim Thomas." You are now conceding that there is a chance he may not turn out that way. Please send me your photo - I must realize my artistic vision and put you on my list of "Birds of Prey" collectibles. I'll open a spot next to Marvin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAHMOR Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: Without him we have no post presence. This statement is very true. He's the only decent post player we have and has a chance to get better. As I stated unless we trade him for a starter/star quality post player we will be taking a serious step back. Trading him for a true PG will kill us as neither SMoove nor Williams are ready to do the work in the post. His two moves that get shut down are usually shut down as the result of help as he was constantly double teamed this past seaon, and the double teams weren't on the perimeter. I'm all for keeping him and even resigning him if necessary. If SMoove or Marv turn out to be better(which they are not even close as of today) then he can be traded. As a second true option I don't have such a problem paying him 7 mil a year. If he puts up 20 points and 9 rebounds a game his numbers support that kind of payment in today's market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholasp27 Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 because we can't afford to extend him for the 9-10+mil/year he's gonna agree to extend for or some team will pay for him next summer... and because he's not the pf we need and because i think smoove is going to be best at pf and al won't like coming off the bench... and marvin doesn't have to be better than smoove...the two of them could grow into the best forward tandem in the league...jj/jc could grow into one of the best backcourts in the league we have the POTENTIAL to have the best 1-4 in the league in 4-5 years...tho i realize that the odds are against that happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Walter Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 1) Ability to play a definate position - versatility is great, but we don't need (anymore) 'tweeners or players than can't play a definate position and aren't so great to redefine a posision. 2) Certain character traits to go along with his good character - Marvin's talent isn't so great IMHO that he can be a great player without intagibles getting him there. I hope he shows more than just good character, but fire, toughness, maybe even an on-court nasty (not dirty) streak that propel him further ... There are other things like ball-handling ability (if he's projected as a Sf especially), big game ability, etc. but I'm thinking globally here. W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Diesel Posted August 18, 2005 Author Premium Member Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Quote: On the other hand, it is actually YOU who is backing off your opinion. At the start of the thread, you said, "after people find out he's the next Tim Thomas." You are now conceding that there is a chance he may not turn out that way. My opinion is still the same. I don't think we have the environment nor do I think Marvin has the innards to propel him past the level of Tim Thomas. When you lack overwhelming talent, you must have something to make up for it. Marvin doesn't have it. Personality wise, I think he's very similar to Reef and Thomas. Guys who have a nice skill set but lacks the --- to reach that next level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seano Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Hahaha ATL_BALLER, great work on the Photoshop images. Literally made me about spew Coke all over my keyboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Diesel Posted March 27, 2007 Author Premium Member Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 Quote: When you have 2 proven PGs and your need is PG, you don't pick a guy based on POTENTIAL when he has not stepped up in the college game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasPete Posted March 27, 2007 Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 It's nice to see you actually were right about something. Funny, you haven't gone back and re-posted the 8,000 things you were off base about. Insecurity is a killer, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Sothron Posted March 27, 2007 Premium Member Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 I was just thinking the same. I could probably pwn the hell out of those realgm.com people who crucified me for all the things I said beforehand about Paul, Deron, Shellhead, etc. and every single one of them came true. But what's the point? I know I was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin chillzatl Posted March 27, 2007 Admin Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 That would be the case when talking about Diesel and his opinions of Marvin. One week Diesel is pro-marvin, the next week, he's anti-marvin. Some people say why, I say "Why bother?". Depending on the week Diesel may or may not be aware that Marvin is young and just like the other young player on our team, needs time to develop. Other weeks, Diesel acts as though he isn't aware of this and is only aware that Marvin was picked #2 overall and should be a star already. again, why bother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exodus Posted March 27, 2007 Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 Diesel's comments not long ago... Quote: Walter, it's easy to go off complaining all day long. However, your complaints are moot. What's the point?? What is there to gain from this constant complaining about these things that can't be changed?? Do you want somebody to concede that you know more than BK? Is that the point of all this?? It is this simple... Every team in the league can talk about what they could have done differently. What they should have done differently..e tc... What makes us so different from them? Nothing. We just have to play with the chips we have. If you don't like our chips, maybe you should find a team with chips you do like to follow. Quote: I think it's a waste of time, bandwidth and what have you to try to find the eutopic Hawks team that we don't have because it doesn't change anything. Quote: The only time I mention Marvin is when Somebody comes in with those same old excuses about how he's going to be KG or Kobe someday but he's being held back by a handbrace or he's being held back by his age or he's being held back by a coach or a GM or the girl on the second row keeps looking at him... Quote: Pick any two GMs in the league who you think are good and I betcha we can find that there were some talents that they missed out on. There are some coulda woulda shoulda for a whole lot of guys. In other words, this conversation is moot. click Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AHF Posted March 27, 2007 Moderators Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 Quote: That would be the case when talking about Diesel and his opinions of Marvin. One week Diesel is pro-marvin, the next week, he's anti-marvin. Some people say why, I say "Why bother?". Depending on the week Diesel may or may not be aware that Marvin is young and just like the other young player on our team, needs time to develop. Other weeks, Diesel acts as though he isn't aware of this and is only aware that Marvin was picked #2 overall and should be a star already. again, why bother. Diesel has been pretty consistent on Marvin, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packfill Posted March 27, 2007 Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 Quote: Quote: That would be the case when talking about Diesel and his opinions of Marvin. One week Diesel is pro-marvin, the next week, he's anti-marvin. Some people say why, I say "Why bother?". Depending on the week Diesel may or may not be aware that Marvin is young and just like the other young player on our team, needs time to develop. Other weeks, Diesel acts as though he isn't aware of this and is only aware that Marvin was picked #2 overall and should be a star already. again, why bother. Diesel has been pretty consistent on Marvin, IMO. Agreed. We know where Diesel stands on Marvin. Walter too. Me 3 probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasPete Posted March 27, 2007 Report Share Posted March 27, 2007 That is funny. It seems he is quite good at giving advice. Not so good in actually following his own words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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